The Impressive Golf R: A Niche Car for Discerning Drivers

When it comes to high-performance cars, many enthusiasts opt for models with bold exterior designs and aggressive styling cues that scream "I'm fast!" The Volkswagen Golf R is a prime example of this trend. With its gold wheels and potent engine, the Golf R stands out from the crowd, but does it offer enough substance to justify its premium price tag?

In contrast to the more garish hot hatch cars on the market, the Golf R is surprisingly understated in its design. In fact, it can be difficult to distinguish it from the standard Golf GTI model at first glance. However, once you get behind the wheel, the real magic happens. The Golf R packs a punch, with a powerful engine that delivers impressive acceleration and handling capabilities.

One of the most appealing aspects of the Golf R is its ability to blend in with its surroundings. Unlike some high-performance cars that are designed to be attention-grabbers, the Golf R contently hides in plain sight. This makes it an excellent choice for those who want a fast and capable car without the need for constant validation from onlookers.

Of course, this practicality comes at a cost: the Golf R is not as flashy or exciting as some of its competitors. For example, the Impressive STI with gold wheels would undoubtedly turn heads on the road. However, such cars often come with hefty price tags that may be out of reach for all but the most serious enthusiasts.

In contrast, the Golf R offers a more affordable alternative. Priced around $40,000, it represents an excellent value proposition for those who want a high-performance car without breaking the bank. While the Golf R may not offer the same level of visual flair as some of its rivals, its understated design is actually a strength in many ways.

So, who is the Golf R really for? For professionals and enthusiasts who appreciate the finer things in life, the Golf R offers a unique combination of performance, practicality, and style. Its limited production run may make it harder to find, but that also contributes to its exclusivity and allure.

Interestingly, Volkswagen has decided to offer the Golf R as an annual model, rather than a rare limited edition. This could be seen as a clever marketing move, as it allows buyers to experience the Golf R year after year with minimal changes. While some may view this strategy as overly cautious, it also speaks to the brand's commitment to creating high-quality cars that appeal to a specific niche audience.

Ultimately, whether or not the Golf R qualifies as a "future classic" is a matter of personal opinion. For those who crave performance and exclusivity above all else, the answer may be yes. However, for others, the Golf R's understated design and relatively modest price tag make it an excellent choice for everyday driving.

To put this into perspective, consider the Audi S3, which offers a similar combination of power and premium features. While both cars are capable in their own right, they cater to different tastes and preferences. If style and prestige are your top priorities, the S3 may be the better choice. On the other hand, if you value practicality, affordability, and genuine driving enjoyment, the Golf R is an excellent option.

For our host, the Golf R represents a more comfortable and refined alternative to some of its competitors. With its plush seats, supportive steering, and exceptional handling capabilities, it's clear that this car is designed with driver enjoyment in mind. Whether you're cruising around town or taking on winding mountain roads, the Golf R delivers an exceptional driving experience.

In conclusion, the Volkswagen Golf R is a niche car that offers an appealing blend of performance, practicality, and style. While it may not be for everyone, its understated design and relatively affordable price tag make it an excellent choice for those who value substance over flash.

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enIt's A Tale of Two Jeeps the brand new Jeep Renegade and something well wee bit older next on talking cars hi there it's time for talking cars with Consumer Reports I'm Tom muchler I'm Jake Fisher and I'm George Kennedy let's get right to it on this side of the studio resend in red is our brand new Jeep Renegade and on the other side of the studio what what is that that is my personal vehicle uh 99 Jeep Cherokee which uh has some modifications it it looks like the tetus Edition is I mean yeah it's that's its own security system it's well plus the fact we had to push it in here a wow can we cut that uh we're still still doing some work on it she's a work in progress I've had it since College um it's it got my brother and I through college uh and we've done a lot of projects on it you know down a 4-in lift uh was it 33in tires um and the bumper that we built ourselves uh from scratch out of a piece of quar in uh steel nice Home Improvement projects good Improvement is a relative term but yeah now the Renegade I mean that really lends itself to a 4-in lift and 33 in tires and now I got to level with you um I don't know if I'm really ready to do this because I haven't actually driven the vehicle I'm drove the rate but I actually haven't driven your car which um looks like a lot of fun actually it it is well you were in it when we we've actually taken it on the the rock wall so as as as a passenger you might have some insights as to as to how it drives yes the infotainment system wasn't wasn't real good it's lacking yeah the the the the '90s aftermarket radio is that's you know not up to your spec no no no but yeah we have the the taale of two Jeeps here this is um really uh I I love the ju the position I think we need more old cars in the studio here like this but um yeah this is um I don't know how many people are going to be lifting these things up um I don't think you can actually I know at least from the Cherokee well you could you could lift I think both of us could actually lift it up like a Mentos commercial yes um but yeah I mean like the Cherokee I remember that that jeep said that basically you can't really get in there and mod it the way that you wanted to CU the the Trail Hawk the only one that can actually do the Rubicon Trail kind of stuff is specs just so that that it can get through there and and if you went and you know did your own work on it I'm sure you'd a Avid a warranty but B I don't you know I don't know what's your car like actually fix with a rock I believe right yeah I I prefer to I mean I was going to say the the off-road a lot of the off-road capability on the Trailhawk versions of the Cherokee and the Renegade is achieved through Electronics basically which you have no there's a radio he said it was a radio yeah so lots of vacuum tub headlights right it's a series of tubes you're you're not you're not turning any little cute little knobs in yours to sand or snow or Mall nope it's it's a lever on the floor manly lever on the floor yep but does this doesn't make the Renegade bad or ill suited for its intended use well that's the question what is the intended use so as a Jeep owner I'll throw it to you George what do you think about the Renegade I'll be gentle and you have to be gentle with it it's kind of cute don't Hur his feelings it's looking right at you well yeah it is look at with those big puppy dog eyes no you see it's furrowed brow it's judging me I think it's intimidated by yours actually it's about to run off yeah I would underneath for an oil spill or something we know there's one your thank you no um it's a vehicle that meets its purpose I mean it's it's a crossover that has been built up and gussied up to look like something that is more Macho and bronny like putting a plaid shirt on me you know what I mean like there's nothing Macho about that well no but it's meant to give off that that AET you know walking around it you don't really pay attention to how low to the ground it is and how small the wheels are and the lack of ground cles cuz cuz you're looking at the squared off angles and the fact that it's got a really cool looking front grill that really does sort of conjure up you know Jeep iconography so okay remember we used to talk about the term used to be cute you when all these little crossovers came out and then all the Crossovers kind of grew up and now small SUVs they're they're family cars now right I mean a Forester and a CRV are family cars they're not cute Utes this is a cute you this thing is ridiculous cute I've been driving around this weekend and like everyone is like coming up to wow wants you to think it's like the but Ute though like it's this like rugged like Western thing at the same time you know but it's look there are a lot of there's a lot of women who drive jeep wranglers there's a lot of people who drive D Jeep Wranglers that are not taking them Offroad they're driving around CU they they're cute you could take the top off can't quite do that on that but I mean SS all you could actually they have they have a CO they have a cool move roof but um you know for people who want to be in a jeep because they that's the way it looks they're not going to be using it for that utility this has got all that cuteness and is a daily driver too so I mean I think there is totally a market for this and honestly I think they they hit this one out of the park but you know the thing is you know me I mean robot Tom is robot you know I am I am not in this market you know but still compared to a Chevy tracks or we've been driving the a new Honda HRV recently and it's just so boring it's so it makes me sad it just I feel depressed driving the HRV it's like like so clinical it's so sanitary this thing this has character I'm going to cry okay so that brings up sort of the this is kind of cool to be driving you know that kind of brings up the conflict that I you know the internal strife that I have over non Wrangler and non Grand Cherokee Jeeps that jeep has been doing for like the last TW you know 15 years with vehicles like the Patriot and the compass you know they I they feel like they've done a better job with this definitely but you know on the one hand it's like okay great they've taken all of the you know the cache that comes and the respect that comes from the Wrangler and the Grand Cherokee and they ring that and they bleed that into other vehicles that don't have that off-road prowess and they they get people to buy it's the halo car effect totally on the other hand if you you know you just suppose that to the other vehicles that are in this market and all of a sudden by doing that you actually have a car that's in this market that actually has some character it totally totally it has character and since since you're not being the clinical Tom I'm gonna have to take over your position here oh I look forward to seeing this very and here's the thing I'm going to say it now this isn't a very good car okay if you want to go and compare I mean we paid what 27 Grand $27,000 and you could pay 27 grand for a Forester and the Forester is roomier and probably is more fuel efficient and it's going to be ride nicer and it's going to have better steering it's going to all the good things it's probably going to be more liable I'll throw that down with no data I mean just based on what we know from from what Chrysler is doing these days and some of the components so as in terms of better vehicle there's going to be a lot better vehicles but if you're looking for something cute and and you know if you're looking for something that's going to go and bring a smile to your face and people going to be waving and they're going to give you a thumbs up I don't know I don't know if the Wrangler guys are going to give you a thumbs up or no you're not Point laugh you're not they'll point and laugh but no to to hang on that point a little bit more the same about 275 that we paid for that car which I mean the fanciest thing that has is a heated steering wheel 275 bought our latest Honda CRV uh with a sunroof with Lane watch with heated with all this stuff that oh one go up what about our um the Kia Soul which had like everything and this is similar rear heated seats it's not all drive but it's not all wheel drive it was five grand less right I mean it's there so many features if you want a vehicle that's boxy or whatever like that but you see here's here's the thing here is why I think these cars are ingenious for the car companies and I'm not convinced where they are for consumers I think they're ingenious for car companies because you're taking what is going to be a pretty inexpensive plat platform and you are getting so much money out of it I mean look at the HRV you have something that's based on the fit which is basically you know what $7,000 car and I like the fit you know I said in earlier podcast I think it's a very Earnest car it is what it is you know and there's limitations but it is what it is once you start turning it into an SUV and jacking it up and adding all-wheel drive and adding a few nice looking things inside the price goes up and it becomes so profitable yeah for the car company and I'll say I mean there there there's plenty of examples from the Buick Encore to the to the Mercedes-Benz CLA but this one I like a lot better well it's GLA but but CLA CLA as well okay so you take the CLA which is because it's based on a boxy little very practical but they've turned it into something that looks like a Mercedes and this is where they've taken an Italian car right this thing's been built in Italy um and was that built in Italy year no no that's never been it doesn't know out of it can't make it that far so I mean so this thing I mean theyve gone and they've done that but you know what this drives a whole lot more like another Jeep or something like a CLA drives like a Mercedes I mean the CLA there's more branded I'm so frustrated with that car just because it doesn't drive like it looks this actually drives pretty good from what you're thinking I mean if you if you drove a liberty or if you drove a or any of these cars this thing this is so much better well just the thing on the profits is all right as a Jeep owner I can almost like make peace with a car like this sort of based on the the Porsche model of the you know Porsche purus for a long time when the when the Ken came out were were you know pulling their hair out over this SUV the paname too but guess what those Vehicles make a ton of profit and those profits they reinvest the development of the next 911 and if that can keep development cost for the next Wrangler and keep that next Wrangler pure vehicle down then I can totally justify this I'm by that justification because the Wrangler the difference is they don't sell that many boxers and 911s and Cayman they sell a lot of Wranglers they should they should be able to make a profit on the Wrangler that assembly line now that to be said the the update you know the new Wrangler will probably be extensively aluminum and I mean it will there will be a lot more money in that car well and just to think about the justification I mean do you need a justification to a vehicle that people want people are going to enjoy um you know what do you mean by justification business justification or purchase justification like like as stick with the program here you know he was saying he could justify because I mean what you're saying is you know as a je purist this thing is ween yeah me basically saying get off my lawn with this thing exactly you're at least that will drive off your law that's just going to I'm already regretting bringing this thing down here okay you just sore from pushing it so but I mean that's the thing so so so I I I I think I think it's really apt to have that that comparison with Porsche right I mean when the first Porsche SUV and the Porsche sedan came out we're all like oh look sky's falling no one's going to like Porsches anymore they sold their soul and lo and behold they're still making lots of you know speedsters and all these different variants of 911 and boxer and more um you know so is that necessarily a bad thing I mean in terms of sky falling you know I I the compass the I mean that was the sky falling when they took a which was this terrible terrible little Dodge and put a grill on it it was not even a grill it was like plastic molded that was awful this is kind of like that's this is a breath of fresh air in this market so yeah all those you know all those previous Jeep crossovers you know this through seven slot Grill on and called it a day at least there's an acknowledgement of Heritage in this vehicle if you look around there are Easter eggs everywhere hundreds of Easter egg it's all right it's it's it's a little it's a little M little every speaker Grill every tail light every there one on the rear view mirror on on the re rearview mirrors on the side up top there's like at least what 16 on each seat every place where you had like a 2X 2 in section of plastic they they St I'm a je remember I'm a Jeep I'm not builing it okay but at least at least there's an acknowledgement of Heritage there as opposed to those other cars it's like you know what take this caliber just make it this make some money and let's get out of here the headlights the tail lights have Jeep just I can't get over how many Jeeps are the the windows there's Jeeps driving up the side of the window glass I mean Chrysler does that our Challenger actually has a challenger silhouette and I think it's kind of cool and it doesn't cost you anything like if P was still around this would be like yo dog we heard you like Jeep we're going to put a Jeep inside exactly yeah um the one there is one you know among all these weird little aesthetic choices there is one thing that is very strange to me it's totally weird quam and that is the tachometer there is no red line to the red line there's mud is it paint or lava my kids think it's mud it's my kids like it but it's orange mud so it's probably a lot I was going to go with flames when the NP speed and the 2. so where's the red line is it like the first blop of mud or is it where it's all solid mud it's there somewhere it's all good and the thing is you you you will never know whether or not you're going to hit the red liner up because the thing the engine is just one of those CH ones that's really loud oh yeah I mean getting back to the it's not a great car that that that 2.4 L is just I mean it's kabi in the dark it's kabi here uh you know there's this magic fingers idle vibration when you're stopped you can actually the transmission the nine-speed is better than it has been in other cars but you can actually get ninth gear I've I've seen nth it's pretty light actually the transmission doesn't work too badly I mean here's the thing I mean this is this this is prancing out of really dangerous territory about like what we recommend and and what you know people should buy I mean it's true it's not that great of a car if you close your eyes to what it is but I suspect people going to buy this be Safi understand why people I think the important thing is that we it's not a great car but we under or we haven't tested it fully yet we have a couple hundred miles on it we know what we think of it but we understand why people would buy it no matter how it scores we understand why people would buy it yeah because people are going in and buying a vehicle that is useful but jeep has baked in enough of this aesthetically to make them think they're buying this when they're buying that you know I don't like this one particular right Fair no my kids go down the street in every Jeep they're like look there a yeah exactly people recognize that there's there it's iconic Jeep is a great brand um it's a great brand and actually it's U getting into the mailbag uh it's time for um people who are mad at what we've done that's what we call this now line up that's what we call it's just the easiest thing to call it uh a couple shows ago you had talked about a friend who was shoing Shing for a small shv and they were thinking of a Cherokee and you said no the reliability is bad yet in the same show we talked about the Vol wagen Golf and how I personally would buy a golf although the reliability is probably a question mark a couple people have uh at least feigned moral Outreach over this I'm ready here here's what we've got Jacob said but you said moments ago that you could not recommend the Jeep because of reliability and then you say the golf is just so good you overlook the reliability of it come on guys I don't think we care any way but we all want consistency another one I see an extrem level hypocrisy when it comes to the golf you guys even mentioned it yourselves during the show that you don't recommend the Cherokee simply because of the reliability you guys repeatedly mentioned that the only reason you don't recommend these cars like the escape and the fa is because reliability and then to make a complete exception you recommend the golf despite the reliability so this is exactly what we're talking about about this this is a perfect segue look what you did there but I mean this is this is the difference between big r capital r recommendation consum reports official recommendation lowercase recommendation Jake Tom George recommendation CU we are very so I mean for us to recommend a vehicle to the masses out there I mean we're going to look at reliability that's important we know that's important to a lot of people um the majority of people that's one of the primary reasons why people are buying new cars but in terms of if you have special needs if you're really into a certain type of vehicle if you really value a sporty Driving Experience or or or what this buys you um yeah you might be very happy with that purchase the other thing I feel bad about is that we've never really spelled out the entire all the pieces of information behind some of the things we've said the golf the golf is a brand new design we do not know its reliability Volkswagen's in recent years the golf has been average or above average the Jetta which the car is Loosely based on that's been average uh well the GTI was actually below GTI L average but but the the Lesser sporting versions have have been all right a lot of this has been in the context of the Mazda 3 versus the golf and yes the Mazda 3 is going to be more reliable than the golf but the golf isn't horrible we know from data the Cherokee is horrible right the Cherokee is way as as the one who created this and and put on blast for this I I think it requires explaining that fine you know the comparative you know you know the amount of reliability that's that's off center for the golf is marginal compared to and we don't know yet but based on previous data we can say that it's not this deep deep well that it has to dig it dig a hole dig itself out of whereas the Cherokee we know is and we know it's wor I would take it one step further though I mean it's not about how how unreliable is it it's about what's important to you and for some people I would recommend you get a GTI if reliability is number one on your list or or right up the top I would I wouldn't recommend you get that vehicle and I think that's what it is we recommend different vehicles for different people and and quite honestly for us I mean this is the worst question you ask if you want to know what you should buy don't say what would you buy because what I would buy is you should get a h Durango everyone out there should buy a youy because Li what I drive like you know what I mean before we started this I was showing you guys that that IM Mar diesel 1984 that was Slamm to theu imar diesel $2,500 on recommendation go buy it everyone um speaking of the golf and speaking of people who should buy it we got a chance to drive a golf R who should buy a Golf R um somebody who basically you know somebody who wants a performance car that you know isn't exactly you know sticks out you know doesn't do the whole look at me look at me thing um like the impress STI with gold wheels and a big right right you know there are all of these high performance cars out there or you know the hot hatch cars they have all these like tack on visual parts that are just really loud and very Juvenile and if you got if you're paying 40 grand for a car you're at least at a position in life where you're probably beyond that you know so the Golf R is very subtle looking it actually looks more subtle than a GTI and it Blends into a crowd but the thing hauls and it's this car that basically won't scare away your in-laws which could be a good or bad thing and and you won't get an instant ticket and sort of Blends into the crap but you can still have a ton of fun in your thoughts we don't have enough time no look I mean when you're getting $40,000 for a golf I mean for me either get yourself a GTI and have that money in the pocket so you could go and Chip it or put different wheels on yourself or bag it if you're into that or you go and and buy yourself a three series because that's really what you want but I think the golf is you know or or or two series or you mentioned before m235i and you know the the golf artist seems like a more useful car than that what if you got you know what if you you know you need space for the kids and whatnot and you you know fine you have your other card to minivan or crossover whatever but this is the car that you can take your family in and still go for a nice Sunday drive you can do that in do with three series that's the problem and you know look I'll defend the Golf R because I I've had two friends who have owned golf RS they're all very similar demographics within a couple years of being 40 they're professionals you know Volkswagen enthusiasts who can afford the golf kind of like or can afford $40,000 or or to be honest they all leased it um you know they like the secret handshake but there's a reason the Golf R only sells you know 3 4,000 because there's not that many people of that demographic you know right and the interesting choice is that whereas the previous generation golf there was a limited run and that was it they're going to offer the Golf R every year of this generation you know maybe in limited numbers of each year but it's an interesting choice cuz I think that that has a play to either you know as they as the generation moves on they might make some minor changes in uh infotainment changes stuff like that but stuff that that will they'll make little differentiations from year to year as people go look back at these as maybe future Classics I have a hard time with being a future classic I think it's a really nice car I like the seats it sounds great it handles great any well any car that's fast and loud and comes in limited numbers will be a future classic to to some degree I mean there are people you know spending good money on original M3s and original GTI and stuff like that H I don't know I I think I think the threshold drops off somewhere especially when you get to four-door hatchbacks I mean unless there's people out there growing up who crave that car and I I think George is totally right when it comes to RS I just don't see it as an R to me an R is that you know yellow 1999 Integra that was you know M modified better than the modifiers and it was only like 23 or $24,000 to me that's R that's like Club sport Razer this thing is basically like a a golf trying to be a a BMW this is golf Platinum limited edition that's what it is but you but you still you still don't get a stuff like sunroof for 40 Grand you know you get almost everything else the sun it's more plush than it is hardc the thing is too I mean it becomes a matter of taste I mean for for a few gram Mo you're within Striking Distance of the Audi S3 so if you're looking for a premium car it you know they both make the same amount of power it's you know they're both all-wheel drive so you know if if that's your thing then go for the the the luxury badge too and now you've got the you know that setup I'd rather have the I'm more comfortable in the golf I'd rather have it hatchback body style but again it's it's very it's a very Niche car I mean really you're really narrowing the funnel down very so that's going to wrap it up for this episode of talking cars as always we thank you for watching we'll see you next timeIt's A Tale of Two Jeeps the brand new Jeep Renegade and something well wee bit older next on talking cars hi there it's time for talking cars with Consumer Reports I'm Tom muchler I'm Jake Fisher and I'm George Kennedy let's get right to it on this side of the studio resend in red is our brand new Jeep Renegade and on the other side of the studio what what is that that is my personal vehicle uh 99 Jeep Cherokee which uh has some modifications it it looks like the tetus Edition is I mean yeah it's that's its own security system it's well plus the fact we had to push it in here a wow can we cut that uh we're still still doing some work on it she's a work in progress I've had it since College um it's it got my brother and I through college uh and we've done a lot of projects on it you know down a 4-in lift uh was it 33in tires um and the bumper that we built ourselves uh from scratch out of a piece of quar in uh steel nice Home Improvement projects good Improvement is a relative term but yeah now the Renegade I mean that really lends itself to a 4-in lift and 33 in tires and now I got to level with you um I don't know if I'm really ready to do this because I haven't actually driven the vehicle I'm drove the rate but I actually haven't driven your car which um looks like a lot of fun actually it it is well you were in it when we we've actually taken it on the the rock wall so as as as a passenger you might have some insights as to as to how it drives yes the infotainment system wasn't wasn't real good it's lacking yeah the the the the '90s aftermarket radio is that's you know not up to your spec no no no but yeah we have the the taale of two Jeeps here this is um really uh I I love the ju the position I think we need more old cars in the studio here like this but um yeah this is um I don't know how many people are going to be lifting these things up um I don't think you can actually I know at least from the Cherokee well you could you could lift I think both of us could actually lift it up like a Mentos commercial yes um but yeah I mean like the Cherokee I remember that that jeep said that basically you can't really get in there and mod it the way that you wanted to CU the the Trail Hawk the only one that can actually do the Rubicon Trail kind of stuff is specs just so that that it can get through there and and if you went and you know did your own work on it I'm sure you'd a Avid a warranty but B I don't you know I don't know what's your car like actually fix with a rock I believe right yeah I I prefer to I mean I was going to say the the off-road a lot of the off-road capability on the Trailhawk versions of the Cherokee and the Renegade is achieved through Electronics basically which you have no there's a radio he said it was a radio yeah so lots of vacuum tub headlights right it's a series of tubes you're you're not you're not turning any little cute little knobs in yours to sand or snow or Mall nope it's it's a lever on the floor manly lever on the floor yep but does this doesn't make the Renegade bad or ill suited for its intended use well that's the question what is the intended use so as a Jeep owner I'll throw it to you George what do you think about the Renegade I'll be gentle and you have to be gentle with it it's kind of cute don't Hur his feelings it's looking right at you well yeah it is look at with those big puppy dog eyes no you see it's furrowed brow it's judging me I think it's intimidated by yours actually it's about to run off yeah I would underneath for an oil spill or something we know there's one your thank you no um it's a vehicle that meets its purpose I mean it's it's a crossover that has been built up and gussied up to look like something that is more Macho and bronny like putting a plaid shirt on me you know what I mean like there's nothing Macho about that well no but it's meant to give off that that AET you know walking around it you don't really pay attention to how low to the ground it is and how small the wheels are and the lack of ground cles cuz cuz you're looking at the squared off angles and the fact that it's got a really cool looking front grill that really does sort of conjure up you know Jeep iconography so okay remember we used to talk about the term used to be cute you when all these little crossovers came out and then all the Crossovers kind of grew up and now small SUVs they're they're family cars now right I mean a Forester and a CRV are family cars they're not cute Utes this is a cute you this thing is ridiculous cute I've been driving around this weekend and like everyone is like coming up to wow wants you to think it's like the but Ute though like it's this like rugged like Western thing at the same time you know but it's look there are a lot of there's a lot of women who drive jeep wranglers there's a lot of people who drive D Jeep Wranglers that are not taking them Offroad they're driving around CU they they're cute you could take the top off can't quite do that on that but I mean SS all you could actually they have they have a CO they have a cool move roof but um you know for people who want to be in a jeep because they that's the way it looks they're not going to be using it for that utility this has got all that cuteness and is a daily driver too so I mean I think there is totally a market for this and honestly I think they they hit this one out of the park but you know the thing is you know me I mean robot Tom is robot you know I am I am not in this market you know but still compared to a Chevy tracks or we've been driving the a new Honda HRV recently and it's just so boring it's so it makes me sad it just I feel depressed driving the HRV it's like like so clinical it's so sanitary this thing this has character I'm going to cry okay so that brings up sort of the this is kind of cool to be driving you know that kind of brings up the conflict that I you know the internal strife that I have over non Wrangler and non Grand Cherokee Jeeps that jeep has been doing for like the last TW you know 15 years with vehicles like the Patriot and the compass you know they I they feel like they've done a better job with this definitely but you know on the one hand it's like okay great they've taken all of the you know the cache that comes and the respect that comes from the Wrangler and the Grand Cherokee and they ring that and they bleed that into other vehicles that don't have that off-road prowess and they they get people to buy it's the halo car effect totally on the other hand if you you know you just suppose that to the other vehicles that are in this market and all of a sudden by doing that you actually have a car that's in this market that actually has some character it totally totally it has character and since since you're not being the clinical Tom I'm gonna have to take over your position here oh I look forward to seeing this very and here's the thing I'm going to say it now this isn't a very good car okay if you want to go and compare I mean we paid what 27 Grand $27,000 and you could pay 27 grand for a Forester and the Forester is roomier and probably is more fuel efficient and it's going to be ride nicer and it's going to have better steering it's going to all the good things it's probably going to be more liable I'll throw that down with no data I mean just based on what we know from from what Chrysler is doing these days and some of the components so as in terms of better vehicle there's going to be a lot better vehicles but if you're looking for something cute and and you know if you're looking for something that's going to go and bring a smile to your face and people going to be waving and they're going to give you a thumbs up I don't know I don't know if the Wrangler guys are going to give you a thumbs up or no you're not Point laugh you're not they'll point and laugh but no to to hang on that point a little bit more the same about 275 that we paid for that car which I mean the fanciest thing that has is a heated steering wheel 275 bought our latest Honda CRV uh with a sunroof with Lane watch with heated with all this stuff that oh one go up what about our um the Kia Soul which had like everything and this is similar rear heated seats it's not all drive but it's not all wheel drive it was five grand less right I mean it's there so many features if you want a vehicle that's boxy or whatever like that but you see here's here's the thing here is why I think these cars are ingenious for the car companies and I'm not convinced where they are for consumers I think they're ingenious for car companies because you're taking what is going to be a pretty inexpensive plat platform and you are getting so much money out of it I mean look at the HRV you have something that's based on the fit which is basically you know what $7,000 car and I like the fit you know I said in earlier podcast I think it's a very Earnest car it is what it is you know and there's limitations but it is what it is once you start turning it into an SUV and jacking it up and adding all-wheel drive and adding a few nice looking things inside the price goes up and it becomes so profitable yeah for the car company and I'll say I mean there there there's plenty of examples from the Buick Encore to the to the Mercedes-Benz CLA but this one I like a lot better well it's GLA but but CLA CLA as well okay so you take the CLA which is because it's based on a boxy little very practical but they've turned it into something that looks like a Mercedes and this is where they've taken an Italian car right this thing's been built in Italy um and was that built in Italy year no no that's never been it doesn't know out of it can't make it that far so I mean so this thing I mean theyve gone and they've done that but you know what this drives a whole lot more like another Jeep or something like a CLA drives like a Mercedes I mean the CLA there's more branded I'm so frustrated with that car just because it doesn't drive like it looks this actually drives pretty good from what you're thinking I mean if you if you drove a liberty or if you drove a or any of these cars this thing this is so much better well just the thing on the profits is all right as a Jeep owner I can almost like make peace with a car like this sort of based on the the Porsche model of the you know Porsche purus for a long time when the when the Ken came out were were you know pulling their hair out over this SUV the paname too but guess what those Vehicles make a ton of profit and those profits they reinvest the development of the next 911 and if that can keep development cost for the next Wrangler and keep that next Wrangler pure vehicle down then I can totally justify this I'm by that justification because the Wrangler the difference is they don't sell that many boxers and 911s and Cayman they sell a lot of Wranglers they should they should be able to make a profit on the Wrangler that assembly line now that to be said the the update you know the new Wrangler will probably be extensively aluminum and I mean it will there will be a lot more money in that car well and just to think about the justification I mean do you need a justification to a vehicle that people want people are going to enjoy um you know what do you mean by justification business justification or purchase justification like like as stick with the program here you know he was saying he could justify because I mean what you're saying is you know as a je purist this thing is ween yeah me basically saying get off my lawn with this thing exactly you're at least that will drive off your law that's just going to I'm already regretting bringing this thing down here okay you just sore from pushing it so but I mean that's the thing so so so I I I I think I think it's really apt to have that that comparison with Porsche right I mean when the first Porsche SUV and the Porsche sedan came out we're all like oh look sky's falling no one's going to like Porsches anymore they sold their soul and lo and behold they're still making lots of you know speedsters and all these different variants of 911 and boxer and more um you know so is that necessarily a bad thing I mean in terms of sky falling you know I I the compass the I mean that was the sky falling when they took a which was this terrible terrible little Dodge and put a grill on it it was not even a grill it was like plastic molded that was awful this is kind of like that's this is a breath of fresh air in this market so yeah all those you know all those previous Jeep crossovers you know this through seven slot Grill on and called it a day at least there's an acknowledgement of Heritage in this vehicle if you look around there are Easter eggs everywhere hundreds of Easter egg it's all right it's it's it's a little it's a little M little every speaker Grill every tail light every there one on the rear view mirror on on the re rearview mirrors on the side up top there's like at least what 16 on each seat every place where you had like a 2X 2 in section of plastic they they St I'm a je remember I'm a Jeep I'm not builing it okay but at least at least there's an acknowledgement of Heritage there as opposed to those other cars it's like you know what take this caliber just make it this make some money and let's get out of here the headlights the tail lights have Jeep just I can't get over how many Jeeps are the the windows there's Jeeps driving up the side of the window glass I mean Chrysler does that our Challenger actually has a challenger silhouette and I think it's kind of cool and it doesn't cost you anything like if P was still around this would be like yo dog we heard you like Jeep we're going to put a Jeep inside exactly yeah um the one there is one you know among all these weird little aesthetic choices there is one thing that is very strange to me it's totally weird quam and that is the tachometer there is no red line to the red line there's mud is it paint or lava my kids think it's mud it's my kids like it but it's orange mud so it's probably a lot I was going to go with flames when the NP speed and the 2. so where's the red line is it like the first blop of mud or is it where it's all solid mud it's there somewhere it's all good and the thing is you you you will never know whether or not you're going to hit the red liner up because the thing the engine is just one of those CH ones that's really loud oh yeah I mean getting back to the it's not a great car that that that 2.4 L is just I mean it's kabi in the dark it's kabi here uh you know there's this magic fingers idle vibration when you're stopped you can actually the transmission the nine-speed is better than it has been in other cars but you can actually get ninth gear I've I've seen nth it's pretty light actually the transmission doesn't work too badly I mean here's the thing I mean this is this this is prancing out of really dangerous territory about like what we recommend and and what you know people should buy I mean it's true it's not that great of a car if you close your eyes to what it is but I suspect people going to buy this be Safi understand why people I think the important thing is that we it's not a great car but we under or we haven't tested it fully yet we have a couple hundred miles on it we know what we think of it but we understand why people would buy it no matter how it scores we understand why people would buy it yeah because people are going in and buying a vehicle that is useful but jeep has baked in enough of this aesthetically to make them think they're buying this when they're buying that you know I don't like this one particular right Fair no my kids go down the street in every Jeep they're like look there a yeah exactly people recognize that there's there it's iconic Jeep is a great brand um it's a great brand and actually it's U getting into the mailbag uh it's time for um people who are mad at what we've done that's what we call this now line up that's what we call it's just the easiest thing to call it uh a couple shows ago you had talked about a friend who was shoing Shing for a small shv and they were thinking of a Cherokee and you said no the reliability is bad yet in the same show we talked about the Vol wagen Golf and how I personally would buy a golf although the reliability is probably a question mark a couple people have uh at least feigned moral Outreach over this I'm ready here here's what we've got Jacob said but you said moments ago that you could not recommend the Jeep because of reliability and then you say the golf is just so good you overlook the reliability of it come on guys I don't think we care any way but we all want consistency another one I see an extrem level hypocrisy when it comes to the golf you guys even mentioned it yourselves during the show that you don't recommend the Cherokee simply because of the reliability you guys repeatedly mentioned that the only reason you don't recommend these cars like the escape and the fa is because reliability and then to make a complete exception you recommend the golf despite the reliability so this is exactly what we're talking about about this this is a perfect segue look what you did there but I mean this is this is the difference between big r capital r recommendation consum reports official recommendation lowercase recommendation Jake Tom George recommendation CU we are very so I mean for us to recommend a vehicle to the masses out there I mean we're going to look at reliability that's important we know that's important to a lot of people um the majority of people that's one of the primary reasons why people are buying new cars but in terms of if you have special needs if you're really into a certain type of vehicle if you really value a sporty Driving Experience or or or what this buys you um yeah you might be very happy with that purchase the other thing I feel bad about is that we've never really spelled out the entire all the pieces of information behind some of the things we've said the golf the golf is a brand new design we do not know its reliability Volkswagen's in recent years the golf has been average or above average the Jetta which the car is Loosely based on that's been average uh well the GTI was actually below GTI L average but but the the Lesser sporting versions have have been all right a lot of this has been in the context of the Mazda 3 versus the golf and yes the Mazda 3 is going to be more reliable than the golf but the golf isn't horrible we know from data the Cherokee is horrible right the Cherokee is way as as the one who created this and and put on blast for this I I think it requires explaining that fine you know the comparative you know you know the amount of reliability that's that's off center for the golf is marginal compared to and we don't know yet but based on previous data we can say that it's not this deep deep well that it has to dig it dig a hole dig itself out of whereas the Cherokee we know is and we know it's wor I would take it one step further though I mean it's not about how how unreliable is it it's about what's important to you and for some people I would recommend you get a GTI if reliability is number one on your list or or right up the top I would I wouldn't recommend you get that vehicle and I think that's what it is we recommend different vehicles for different people and and quite honestly for us I mean this is the worst question you ask if you want to know what you should buy don't say what would you buy because what I would buy is you should get a h Durango everyone out there should buy a youy because Li what I drive like you know what I mean before we started this I was showing you guys that that IM Mar diesel 1984 that was Slamm to theu imar diesel $2,500 on recommendation go buy it everyone um speaking of the golf and speaking of people who should buy it we got a chance to drive a golf R who should buy a Golf R um somebody who basically you know somebody who wants a performance car that you know isn't exactly you know sticks out you know doesn't do the whole look at me look at me thing um like the impress STI with gold wheels and a big right right you know there are all of these high performance cars out there or you know the hot hatch cars they have all these like tack on visual parts that are just really loud and very Juvenile and if you got if you're paying 40 grand for a car you're at least at a position in life where you're probably beyond that you know so the Golf R is very subtle looking it actually looks more subtle than a GTI and it Blends into a crowd but the thing hauls and it's this car that basically won't scare away your in-laws which could be a good or bad thing and and you won't get an instant ticket and sort of Blends into the crap but you can still have a ton of fun in your thoughts we don't have enough time no look I mean when you're getting $40,000 for a golf I mean for me either get yourself a GTI and have that money in the pocket so you could go and Chip it or put different wheels on yourself or bag it if you're into that or you go and and buy yourself a three series because that's really what you want but I think the golf is you know or or or two series or you mentioned before m235i and you know the the golf artist seems like a more useful car than that what if you got you know what if you you know you need space for the kids and whatnot and you you know fine you have your other card to minivan or crossover whatever but this is the car that you can take your family in and still go for a nice Sunday drive you can do that in do with three series that's the problem and you know look I'll defend the Golf R because I I've had two friends who have owned golf RS they're all very similar demographics within a couple years of being 40 they're professionals you know Volkswagen enthusiasts who can afford the golf kind of like or can afford $40,000 or or to be honest they all leased it um you know they like the secret handshake but there's a reason the Golf R only sells you know 3 4,000 because there's not that many people of that demographic you know right and the interesting choice is that whereas the previous generation golf there was a limited run and that was it they're going to offer the Golf R every year of this generation you know maybe in limited numbers of each year but it's an interesting choice cuz I think that that has a play to either you know as they as the generation moves on they might make some minor changes in uh infotainment changes stuff like that but stuff that that will they'll make little differentiations from year to year as people go look back at these as maybe future Classics I have a hard time with being a future classic I think it's a really nice car I like the seats it sounds great it handles great any well any car that's fast and loud and comes in limited numbers will be a future classic to to some degree I mean there are people you know spending good money on original M3s and original GTI and stuff like that H I don't know I I think I think the threshold drops off somewhere especially when you get to four-door hatchbacks I mean unless there's people out there growing up who crave that car and I I think George is totally right when it comes to RS I just don't see it as an R to me an R is that you know yellow 1999 Integra that was you know M modified better than the modifiers and it was only like 23 or $24,000 to me that's R that's like Club sport Razer this thing is basically like a a golf trying to be a a BMW this is golf Platinum limited edition that's what it is but you but you still you still don't get a stuff like sunroof for 40 Grand you know you get almost everything else the sun it's more plush than it is hardc the thing is too I mean it becomes a matter of taste I mean for for a few gram Mo you're within Striking Distance of the Audi S3 so if you're looking for a premium car it you know they both make the same amount of power it's you know they're both all-wheel drive so you know if if that's your thing then go for the the the luxury badge too and now you've got the you know that setup I'd rather have the I'm more comfortable in the golf I'd rather have it hatchback body style but again it's it's very it's a very Niche car I mean really you're really narrowing the funnel down very so that's going to wrap it up for this episode of talking cars as always we thank you for watching we'll see you next time\n"