The Possibility of Intelligent Gas Giants and the Nature of God

As we explore the vastness of our universe, it's impossible not to wonder about the possibility of intelligent gas giants emerging on planets like Jupiter. The idea may seem far-fetched, but let's consider the concept of vortices spontaneously emerging on gas giants, creating self-stabilizing patterns and feedback loops that could lead to emergent intelligence. Imagine a planet with swirling storm systems that use electromagnetic fields to influence the behavior of ferromagnetic clouds, giving rise to complex structures and ultimately, an intelligent being.

This idea is not as far-fetched as it seems. If we consider the emergence of life on Earth, it's possible that similar conditions could give rise to intelligent gas giants elsewhere in the universe. The possibility of panspermia, where microorganisms are transferred between planets, also raises the prospect of extraterrestrial life taking hold and evolving into complex forms.

The concept of intelligent gas giants challenges our traditional understanding of the origin of life and the nature of intelligence. If such a being were to emerge, it would likely have its own unique perspective on the universe and our place within it. This idea is reminiscent of the Lam Solaris scenario, where an intelligent entity emerges from the collective unconscious, aware of its existence as a sinking planet but refusing to replicate itself.

The possibility of intelligent gas giants also raises questions about the role of God or a higher power in creation. The Christian concept of a supernatural being creating the universe and imbuing it with meaning is seen by some as a mistranslation of the original Greek text, Genesis, which is actually a description of cognitive development in every mind. According to this view, the creation story is not about a deity but rather an account of how we make sense of the world through our experiences and perceptions.

The idea that the universe could be seen as a vast computer system, with God or a higher power acting as its prime mover, also raises interesting questions. If things are moving and changing in the universe, there must be a cause for these movements. This concept is reminiscent of Aristotle's First Cause, which posits that something must move everything else into motion. However, if this prime mover is seen as an automaton or a computational system, then our understanding of its properties and nature becomes more nuanced.

The notion that the universe could be seen as a civilization, with us being part of it, also offers a fresh perspective on the concept of God or higher power. This idea suggests that we are not separate from the universe but rather an integral part of it, with our experiences and perceptions shaping our understanding of reality. In this view, the Christian concept of God is not about a deity outside of us but rather about our own cognitive development and our relationship with others.

Ultimately, the possibility of intelligent gas giants and the nature of God remain topics of debate and speculation. While we may never know for certain whether such beings exist or not, exploring these ideas can lead to new insights and perspectives on the human condition. As Joshua mentioned, "happiness is a cookie that brain bakes itself." This idea suggests that meaning and purpose are not given to us by external forces but rather emerge from our own experiences and perceptions.

As we continue to explore the universe and push the boundaries of human knowledge, it's essential to maintain an open mind and consider alternative perspectives. The conversation about the nature of God and intelligent gas giants serves as a reminder that there is still much to learn and discover in this vast and wondrous cosmos.

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enso do you think suffering is fundamental to happiness along these lines suffering is the result of caring about things that you cannot change and if you are able to change what you care about to those things that you can change you will not suffer well then would you then be able to experience happiness yes but happiness itself is not important happiness is like a cookie when you are a child you think cookies are very important and you want to have all the cookies in the world you look forward to being an adult because then you have as many cookies as you want right yes but as an adult you realize a cookie as a tool it's a tool to make you eat vegetables and once you eat your vegetables anyway you stop eating cookies for the most part because otherwise you will get diabetes and will not be around for your kids yes but then the cookie the scarcity of a cookie if scarcity is enforced nevertheless so like the pleasure comes from the scarcity yes but the happiness is a cookie that your brain bakes for itself it's not made by the environment the moment cannot make you happy it's your appraisal of the environment that makes you happy and if you can change the appraisal of the environment which you can learn too then you can create arbitrary states of happiness and some meditators fall into this trap so they discover the room this basement room in their brain where the cookies are made and they indulge in stuff themselves and after a few months it gets really old and the big crisis of meaning comes because they thought before that their unhappiness was the result of not being happy enough so they fix this right they can release the neurotransmitters at will if they train and then the crisis of meaning pops up at a deeper layer and the question is why do I live how can I make a sustainable civilization that is meaningful to me I'll kinda insert myself into this and this was the problem that you couldn't solve in the first place well at the end of all this let me then ask that same question what is that the answer to that what could the possible answer be of the meaning of life what what could an answer be what is it to you I think that if you look at the limiting of life you look at what the cell is little the knife is the cell is cell yes or this principle the cell it's this self-organizing thing that can participate in evolution in order to make it work it's a molecular machine it Zef replicator an entropy extractor and the Turing machine if any of these parts is missing you don't have a cell and decay is not living right and life is facing the emergent complexity over that principle once you have this intelligent super molecule the cell there's very little that you cannot make it to it's probably the optimal compute for nietzermann especially in terms of resilience it's very hard to sterilize the plant at once it's infected with life so it's active function of these three components over this super cell of cell is as present in the cell is present in us and it's just the are just an expression of the surge the certain layer of complexity and the organization of cells that so in a way it's tempting to think of the cell as a von neumann probe if you want to build intelligence on other planets the best way to do this is to infect them with cells and wait for long enough and visit reasonable chance the stuff is going to evolve into an information processing principle that is general enough to become sentient whether that idea is very akin to sort of the same dream and beautiful ideas that are expressed the cellular automata in their most simple mathematical form you just inject the system with some basic mechanisms of replication so our basic rules amazing things would emerge that the cell is able to do something that James Hardie called existential design he points out that in technical design we go from the outside in we work in a highly controlled environment in which everything is deterministic like about computers of our labs or our engineering workshops and then we use this determinism to implement a particular kind of function that we dream up and that seamlessly interfaces with all the other deterministic functions that we already have in our world so it's basically from the outside in and that logical systems designed from the inside out is seed will become a seedling by taking some of the relatively unorganized matter around it and turn it into its own structure and thereby subdue the environment and cells can cooperate if they can rely on other cells having a similar organization that is already compatible but unless that's that's there the cell needs to divide to create that structure by itself right so it's a self organizing principle that works on a sum chaotic environment and the purpose of life in the sense is to produce complexity and the complexity allows you to harvest negentropy gradients that you couldn't harvest without the complexity and in the sense intelligence and life are very strongly connected because the purpose of intelligence is to allow control and the conditions of complexity so basically you shift the boundary between the ordered systems into the realm of the chaos of chaos you build bridge sets into a chaos with complexity and this is what we are doing this is not necessarily a deeper meaning I think the meaning that we have priors for that we evolved for outside of the priors there is no meaning meaning only exists if a mine projects it right yeah there is holy civilization I think that what feels most meaningful to me is to try to build and maintain the sustainable civilization and taking a sliced Abad outside of there we talked about a man with a beard and God but something some mechanism perhaps must have planted the seed the initial seed of the cell do you think there is a God what is a God and what would that look like so if there was no spontaneous abiogenesis in the sense that the first cell formed by some happy random accidents where the molecules just happened to be in the right consultation to each other but there could also be the mechanism of that allows for the random I mean there's like Turtles all the way down there seems to be there has to be a head turtle at the bottom and what I'm siddur something really wild imagine is it possible that a gas giant could become intelligent but would that involve so imagine you jet you have vortices that spontaneously emerge on the gas giants like big storm systems that in draw for thousands of years and some of these form systems would use electromagnetic fields because some of the clouds are ferromagnetic or something and as a result they can change how certain clouds react rather than other clouds and thereby produce some self-stabilizing patterns that eventually to regulation feedback loops nested feedback loops and control so imagine you have such this thing that basically has emergent self-sustaining self-organizing complexity in a some point this wakes up and realizes in basically Lam Solaris I am a sinking planet yes but I will not replicate because I cannot recreate the conditions of my own existence somewhere else I'm just basically an intelligence that has spontaneously formed because it could and now it builds of anointment probe and the best for normal purpose at resting might be the cell so maybe it will because it's very very clever and very enduring create cells and sends them out and one of them has infected our planet and I'm not suggesting that this is the case but it would be compatible with the prints permian hypothesis and it was my intuition that our biogenesis is very unlikely it's possible but it's you probably need to roll the cosmic dice very often maybe more often than they are planetary surfaces I don't know so god is just a large enough a system that's large enough that allows randomness now I don't think that God has anything to do with creation I think it's a mistranslation of the time would into the catholic mythology i think that Genesis is actually the childhood memories of a god so the when sorry that he Anna says is the world the childhood memories of a God it's basically a mind that is memory remembering how it came into being and we typically interpret Genesis is the creation of a physical universe by a supernatural being yes and I think when you'll read it there is light in darkness that is being created and then you discover sky and ground you create them you will construct the plants and the animals and you give everything that in their names and so on that's basically cognitive development it's a sequence of steps that every mind is to go through then it makes sense of the world and then you have children you can see how initially they distinguish light and darkness and then they make out directions in it and they discover sky and ground and they discover the plants and the animals and they give everything their name and it's an creative process that happens in every mind because it's not given right your mind has to invent these structures to make sense of the patterns on your retina also if there was some big nerd who set up a server and runs this world on it this would not create a special relationship between us and the nerd this nerd would not have the magical power to give me to our existence right so this equation of a creator god is the god of meaning is a slate of hand you shouldn't do it the other one that is done in Catholicism is the equation of the first mover the prime mover of Aristotle which is basically automaton that runs the universe earth total says if things are moving and things seem to be moving here something must move them right if something moves them something must move the thing that is moving it so there must be a prime mover this idea to say that this prime mover is a supernatural being is complete nonsense right it's an automaton in the simplest case so we have to explain the anomaly that this automaton exists at all but again we don't have any possibility to infer anything about its properties except that it's able to produce change and information right so there needs to be some kind of computational principle this is all there is but to say this automaton is identical again with the creator of first cause over the thing that gives meaning to our life is confusion now I think that what we perceive is the higher being that we are part of and the higher being that we are part of is the civilization it's the thing in which we have a similar relationship as the cell has 12 a body and we have this prior because we have evolved to organize in these structures so basically the Christian God in its natural form without the mythology if you undress it it's basically the Platonic form of the civilization as the is the ideal so it's this idea that you try to approximate when you interact with others not based on your incentives but on what you think is right Wow we covered a lot of ground and we left with one of my favorite lines and there's many which is happiness is a cookie that brain bakes itself it's been a huge honor and a pleasure to talk to you I'm sure our paths will cross many times again Joshua thank you so much for talking today earlier Thank You Lex it's so much fun I enjoyed it awesome youso do you think suffering is fundamental to happiness along these lines suffering is the result of caring about things that you cannot change and if you are able to change what you care about to those things that you can change you will not suffer well then would you then be able to experience happiness yes but happiness itself is not important happiness is like a cookie when you are a child you think cookies are very important and you want to have all the cookies in the world you look forward to being an adult because then you have as many cookies as you want right yes but as an adult you realize a cookie as a tool it's a tool to make you eat vegetables and once you eat your vegetables anyway you stop eating cookies for the most part because otherwise you will get diabetes and will not be around for your kids yes but then the cookie the scarcity of a cookie if scarcity is enforced nevertheless so like the pleasure comes from the scarcity yes but the happiness is a cookie that your brain bakes for itself it's not made by the environment the moment cannot make you happy it's your appraisal of the environment that makes you happy and if you can change the appraisal of the environment which you can learn too then you can create arbitrary states of happiness and some meditators fall into this trap so they discover the room this basement room in their brain where the cookies are made and they indulge in stuff themselves and after a few months it gets really old and the big crisis of meaning comes because they thought before that their unhappiness was the result of not being happy enough so they fix this right they can release the neurotransmitters at will if they train and then the crisis of meaning pops up at a deeper layer and the question is why do I live how can I make a sustainable civilization that is meaningful to me I'll kinda insert myself into this and this was the problem that you couldn't solve in the first place well at the end of all this let me then ask that same question what is that the answer to that what could the possible answer be of the meaning of life what what could an answer be what is it to you I think that if you look at the limiting of life you look at what the cell is little the knife is the cell is cell yes or this principle the cell it's this self-organizing thing that can participate in evolution in order to make it work it's a molecular machine it Zef replicator an entropy extractor and the Turing machine if any of these parts is missing you don't have a cell and decay is not living right and life is facing the emergent complexity over that principle once you have this intelligent super molecule the cell there's very little that you cannot make it to it's probably the optimal compute for nietzermann especially in terms of resilience it's very hard to sterilize the plant at once it's infected with life so it's active function of these three components over this super cell of cell is as present in the cell is present in us and it's just the are just an expression of the surge the certain layer of complexity and the organization of cells that so in a way it's tempting to think of the cell as a von neumann probe if you want to build intelligence on other planets the best way to do this is to infect them with cells and wait for long enough and visit reasonable chance the stuff is going to evolve into an information processing principle that is general enough to become sentient whether that idea is very akin to sort of the same dream and beautiful ideas that are expressed the cellular automata in their most simple mathematical form you just inject the system with some basic mechanisms of replication so our basic rules amazing things would emerge that the cell is able to do something that James Hardie called existential design he points out that in technical design we go from the outside in we work in a highly controlled environment in which everything is deterministic like about computers of our labs or our engineering workshops and then we use this determinism to implement a particular kind of function that we dream up and that seamlessly interfaces with all the other deterministic functions that we already have in our world so it's basically from the outside in and that logical systems designed from the inside out is seed will become a seedling by taking some of the relatively unorganized matter around it and turn it into its own structure and thereby subdue the environment and cells can cooperate if they can rely on other cells having a similar organization that is already compatible but unless that's that's there the cell needs to divide to create that structure by itself right so it's a self organizing principle that works on a sum chaotic environment and the purpose of life in the sense is to produce complexity and the complexity allows you to harvest negentropy gradients that you couldn't harvest without the complexity and in the sense intelligence and life are very strongly connected because the purpose of intelligence is to allow control and the conditions of complexity so basically you shift the boundary between the ordered systems into the realm of the chaos of chaos you build bridge sets into a chaos with complexity and this is what we are doing this is not necessarily a deeper meaning I think the meaning that we have priors for that we evolved for outside of the priors there is no meaning meaning only exists if a mine projects it right yeah there is holy civilization I think that what feels most meaningful to me is to try to build and maintain the sustainable civilization and taking a sliced Abad outside of there we talked about a man with a beard and God but something some mechanism perhaps must have planted the seed the initial seed of the cell do you think there is a God what is a God and what would that look like so if there was no spontaneous abiogenesis in the sense that the first cell formed by some happy random accidents where the molecules just happened to be in the right consultation to each other but there could also be the mechanism of that allows for the random I mean there's like Turtles all the way down there seems to be there has to be a head turtle at the bottom and what I'm siddur something really wild imagine is it possible that a gas giant could become intelligent but would that involve so imagine you jet you have vortices that spontaneously emerge on the gas giants like big storm systems that in draw for thousands of years and some of these form systems would use electromagnetic fields because some of the clouds are ferromagnetic or something and as a result they can change how certain clouds react rather than other clouds and thereby produce some self-stabilizing patterns that eventually to regulation feedback loops nested feedback loops and control so imagine you have such this thing that basically has emergent self-sustaining self-organizing complexity in a some point this wakes up and realizes in basically Lam Solaris I am a sinking planet yes but I will not replicate because I cannot recreate the conditions of my own existence somewhere else I'm just basically an intelligence that has spontaneously formed because it could and now it builds of anointment probe and the best for normal purpose at resting might be the cell so maybe it will because it's very very clever and very enduring create cells and sends them out and one of them has infected our planet and I'm not suggesting that this is the case but it would be compatible with the prints permian hypothesis and it was my intuition that our biogenesis is very unlikely it's possible but it's you probably need to roll the cosmic dice very often maybe more often than they are planetary surfaces I don't know so god is just a large enough a system that's large enough that allows randomness now I don't think that God has anything to do with creation I think it's a mistranslation of the time would into the catholic mythology i think that Genesis is actually the childhood memories of a god so the when sorry that he Anna says is the world the childhood memories of a God it's basically a mind that is memory remembering how it came into being and we typically interpret Genesis is the creation of a physical universe by a supernatural being yes and I think when you'll read it there is light in darkness that is being created and then you discover sky and ground you create them you will construct the plants and the animals and you give everything that in their names and so on that's basically cognitive development it's a sequence of steps that every mind is to go through then it makes sense of the world and then you have children you can see how initially they distinguish light and darkness and then they make out directions in it and they discover sky and ground and they discover the plants and the animals and they give everything their name and it's an creative process that happens in every mind because it's not given right your mind has to invent these structures to make sense of the patterns on your retina also if there was some big nerd who set up a server and runs this world on it this would not create a special relationship between us and the nerd this nerd would not have the magical power to give me to our existence right so this equation of a creator god is the god of meaning is a slate of hand you shouldn't do it the other one that is done in Catholicism is the equation of the first mover the prime mover of Aristotle which is basically automaton that runs the universe earth total says if things are moving and things seem to be moving here something must move them right if something moves them something must move the thing that is moving it so there must be a prime mover this idea to say that this prime mover is a supernatural being is complete nonsense right it's an automaton in the simplest case so we have to explain the anomaly that this automaton exists at all but again we don't have any possibility to infer anything about its properties except that it's able to produce change and information right so there needs to be some kind of computational principle this is all there is but to say this automaton is identical again with the creator of first cause over the thing that gives meaning to our life is confusion now I think that what we perceive is the higher being that we are part of and the higher being that we are part of is the civilization it's the thing in which we have a similar relationship as the cell has 12 a body and we have this prior because we have evolved to organize in these structures so basically the Christian God in its natural form without the mythology if you undress it it's basically the Platonic form of the civilization as the is the ideal so it's this idea that you try to approximate when you interact with others not based on your incentives but on what you think is right Wow we covered a lot of ground and we left with one of my favorite lines and there's many which is happiness is a cookie that brain bakes itself it's been a huge honor and a pleasure to talk to you I'm sure our paths will cross many times again Joshua thank you so much for talking today earlier Thank You Lex it's so much fun I enjoyed it awesome you\n"