Intel's Pricing Strategy: A Shift from Profit to Progress

As Intel embarks on its latest generation of CPU releases, it has made a significant decision that may come as a relief to many enthusiasts and integrators. The company has announced price cuts for existing 9-Series chips, making it easier for those in the industry to work with these CPUs without breaking the bank. This move comes at a time when Intel is working on new and more powerful CPU designs, including the upcoming 7000-series chip.

One of the main reasons behind this decision is that it allows Intel to focus on delivering its next-generation products without the pressure of maintaining high prices for existing technology. By cutting prices on its existing chips, Intel can free up resources and investment to push the boundaries of innovation, ensuring that customers get the best possible performance and value for their money.

The impact of this strategy will be felt across various segments of the market, from small-form-factor PC builders to major system integrators. For those who have been waiting patiently for Intel's next-generation CPUs, this move is a welcome relief. No longer will they have to wait months or even years for new technology to emerge; instead, they can look forward to improved performance and capabilities without the hefty price tag.

For those who have invested in existing 9-Series motherboards, however, there may be some concerns about compatibility with future CPUs. Intel's recent design choices, such as the inclusion of M2 chips on certain platforms, have raised questions about how these components will interact with future hardware. While some enthusiasts may view this as a minor issue, others may see it as a major headache.

In reality, however, many of the concerns around compatibility and pricing can be mitigated by careful planning and investment in new technology. By cutting prices on existing chips, Intel is signaling that it is committed to making its next-generation products more accessible to a wider range of customers. This shift in strategy may also encourage more companies to invest in Intel's CPUs, driving innovation and progress in the industry.

The impact of this strategy will not be limited to the PC market alone; Intel's recent performance on the ARM front has been impressive, with some use cases seeing leaps in performance that are comparable to those seen on high-end Apple hardware. This trend is likely to continue as Intel continues to push the boundaries of what is possible with its CPUs.

One area where Intel is taking a significant step forward is in the realm of consumer electronics. The recent shift towards ARM-based processors, combined with improved performance and power efficiency, makes it clear that Intel's next-generation chips will be capable of delivering unparalleled performance in low-power devices. Whether this means faster video editing on iPads or smartphones, or improved gaming capabilities, one thing is certain: Intel is poised to make a significant impact in the consumer electronics market.

While some may argue that Intel's focus on high-performance CPUs has led to a lack of innovation in other areas, it's clear that the company is committed to delivering exceptional performance and value to its customers. By cutting prices on existing chips and investing in new technology, Intel is sending a clear message that it is dedicated to making its next-generation products the best they can be.

The impact of this strategy will not be limited to Intel's competitors alone; many consumers are already experiencing the benefits of improved performance and value in their devices. Whether it's faster video editing on laptops or improved gaming capabilities, it's clear that Intel's next-generation CPUs are capable of delivering exceptional results.

In conclusion, Intel's decision to cut prices on existing 9-Series chips is a significant move that signals the company's commitment to innovation and progress. By making its next-generation products more accessible to a wider range of customers, Intel is driving growth and investment in the industry. As we look forward to the future of CPU technology, it's clear that Intel is poised to make a significant impact.

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enso it turns out that X 299 is dead I think like I just it's dead mine's dead you've gotta send me down a DX e that we deleted and we squeezed as much performance as possible out of it I think Intel was wasting everybody's time thanks to 99 I mean I love Intel I love their like AMD has woken them up the slumbering giant is like oh wait we can squeeze more performance out of silicon oh we didn't realize so something's gonna be really awesome before too long maybe next year maybe the year after we'd want after that but x2 now I'm Lucy for you so on X 9 is wasting everybody's time we're gonna talk about why ya only v speak in absolutes yeah pretty much except for now I mean mostly change that policy yeah mostly it's true that there probably are some nice cat use cases for X 299 but it's really frustrating because x2 now 9 should have probably you know stop with seventh generation eighth generation should ease us into something else you might be thinking but wait there's nothing past x2 99 that's not true there's 36:47 there's always more it's not what we're given you know in the store you get it in servers and so we actually did see 36 47 not this past Computex in June of 2019 but in June of 2018 yeah we're going going into q4 of 2019 intel promised us almost a year ago the W 3175 X which actually is in stock at Newegg at the time we're doing this but I got to get a $1600 board and the cpu costs $3,000 and the motherboard is you know like this big yeah and has like two power supplies worth of hookups like there's a lot of sacrifices you have to make to use that much power although with how much I've put in on my 79 ATX II honestly anything's looking great at the moment I'm like the guy lock lock lock the desert that's walking through looking at mirages and just trying to figure out you know what the best processor is I'm pretty sure you could just throw me like a quad-core and I'm gonna think it's better if it's cooler is it emanating heat into my brain you can have 10 gigahertz but only four cords or twenty eight cores but only one Giga this is basically the choice I mean it's really true and this is this video we're gonna talk a little bit about AMD and what AMD is doing but really only in the context of like forcing Intel's hand and X to 99 as a refresh like we don't even have any inside info I don't know I don't know what's coming up I'm expecting like a clock bump and we'll talk about hypotheticals and that kind of thing but I just don't see how Intel could possibly pull a rabbit out of a hat with X 299 it's too limited in terms of single thread performance it's too limited in terms of clock speed it's too limited in terms of PCIe lanes the motherboards already out there there's not a chipset refresh so what's happening and like yeah what we're gonna get is gonna beat the ten ninety and ten nine eighty x II it's still gonna be soldered it's gonna be like 3.9 gigahertz and it's the same core count in the same heat and maybe one little extra feature but with none of the motherboards being really all that adaptable we're at least past the point of getting all the you know you only get this mini PCIe lanes with this chip and this Smitty with this ship like we're past that point but it's all going to fit and in seventh gen 79-80 was an amazing processor like I remember all of the hyper on it that's why I was so excited to have it in my system but three years later I'm begging someone to take it away from me so you really have to look at like the history of the 2011 socket and the 2011 socket really got started with Sandy Bridge but they tweaked it they tweaked it around I think brought well and so you have these Zeon's like the e5 2680 v3 and v4 those are legendary CPUs and I mention them specifically because basically tweaked versions of that is what we got for some of these high-end desktop processors it's just the on three badges I haven't unlocked maybe with some other tweaks and features and I don't want to minimize that I mean Intel's done a lot of work in that not necessarily on the silicon but qualification and testing and a lot of QA and QC that really honestly Intel's competition probably could learn from just a little bit in terms of you know testing and integration and that kind of thing but it's it's come to the socket is overdue so like when that socket stops being relevant in a server space Intel can still get some more money out of their tooling and the AIB partners can get some money out of their tooling they can repurpose some of those server boards as enthusiast boards as desktop boards and I get it it makes sense and that was really appealing at first like that was the cool part is there's a you know there was a plethora of reasons that you couldn't necessarily use some of the server boards or the server chips in a desktop environment directly without making some sacrifices and some little things and Intel put into work to make that usable and allowed some of us that were you know googling over or googling over the the sr2 motherboards the dual socket like gaming motherboards that were basically vaporware and wishing we had those in our system like that was when I first got into tech YouTube they kind of made that a reality and that was really cool but AMD has come in and done that better and it's you can't just keep rerelease it it's no longer impressive anymore like the scrappy little underdog with a tenth of the resources who's come in and like something has clearly Dolf gone wrong here because and thread report it's are now basically just epic chips and the epic chips are really really good I like I mean Intel has some of the most intelligent people working for it and they have basically a limitless supply of money so those are not the problems there's got to be so I know as we talked about like fabrication engineering you know things like that I just think that Intel sort of gave up I mean that they looked at it and they were like we're hitting the limits with the laws of physics we can violate the laws of physics and it's like okay we'll just go in a different direction to find a workaround and their competition has done that and a competition and tsmc more than I envy I think has done that because Amy's at the mercy of the foundries it's not really it's a name the tsmc partnership thing but this is not really a MV versus Intel it's really TSM C+ GlobalFoundries plus samsung plus other people versus Intel so it's like all of these companies working to try to come up with a better fabrication process than Intel leading to a better product but look at how well Intel does I mean if we look at the 9900 K the cache size is tiny it is really really tiny the cache size on on AMD is mammoth and it takes a mammoth amount of cash to compete with Intel if Intel's got you know engineering that's so good that they only need a fraction of the cash to compete with AMD then imagine what will happen when Intel really you know sort of gets their engineers out and engineers get in engineering mode which is I think we're seeing with Jim Keller and some of the other people that product is really exciting that product is not X 299 that's why I think extra money on is dead Intel couldn't do something different like I mean obviously it takes a fabrication capacity and some engineering into a PC to release another round of X 299 processors but you might be thinking we don't have enthusiast server motherboards we don't have enthusiast 36:47 motherboards it's too late we need to put a lot of engineering time into those you're wrong you're wrong at site because we already had the Dominus motherboard get the Dominus motherboard and the Auris extreme motherboard from gigabyte we know those exist we saw those at context but also we've got surfer motherboards we got you know as rock rack has some really incredible server motherboards they even get up an ITX sort of motherboard I saw that on Linus tech tips oh yeah on the internet and in servers and places like that so it's a server motherboard 3647 you can take that as a starting point and start customizing it it's not like you're reinventing the wheel the new Mac Pro's the iMac Pro is x2 99 which is kind of funny cuz it's like and I'm at pros kind of a toy but the new Mac Pro's actually used 3647 it s use all this nonsense which is a waste of everybody's time at this point and like especially with all of you know there's been a lot of videos trying to beat Apple's Mac Pro or whatever if we could get that motherboard and like a consumer you know that you could buy on its own it would be an amazing platform like the Mac Pro is an amazing platform Apple miss aside and we could get a lot of that and that's that's what a lot of us have wanted out of it out of the enthusiasts stuff and that was a lot of the energy that was turned up you know on the enthusiast side was can we take all of this cut off some of the enterprise stuff that we're not using and just go ham with the specs and I one way they went a ham with the specs was visa is because the Mac Pro has 64 PCI Express lanes it's not a PLA exploit or anything like that Intel looks like Intel reuse the quickpath interconnect which is normally what you would use for a to socket system they use some of those interface interconnects to just repurpose them as PCI Express Lanes which is fine 64 PCI Express Lanes at 36 47 sounds like a great workstation chip to me that's honestly been a lot of especially on the workstation side gaming sides obviously a little different most people don't care but on the workstation enthusiast side the lane limitation has been one of the biggest like hurdles for them to overcome and 44 sounds like enough but you start running into issues with the nvme layout you have all of the nvme routed through the single DMI that is choking when you're trying to use like kinds of like throughput that I'm trying to put my system through it sounds great I can get for nvme drives on my ex 299 built which is bonkers but they all perform like one nvme drive or or less or left communicate between them because of the overhead and even less if you're using qlc drives like I made the mistake of doing a couple with and I drives that oops yeah um but it's getting choked whereas none of that issue happens on certain other if we look at what AMD is doing they've got their server socket and their desktop socket and when Roslyn first came out I was kind of critical to desktop sake I was like I would have liked to have seen triple channel memory you know I would have liked to see more maybe four more PCI Express Lanes we went from 16 to 20 plus 4 for the chipset which then breaks out and now on a m4 because of PCI Express 4.0 those PCI Express lanes go a lot farther I was not expecting PCI Express 4 on Zen - I was maybe Zen 3 but that's not gonna be a m4 and here we've got PCI Express 4 on a m4 that really changes the game 32 cores you know with the threader 432 core everybody was saying there wasn't enough memory bandwidth so 16 cores with dual channel looked like it wasn't gonna be enough memory bandwidth let's move thought it was Windows I forget I got I always work that in so it's like us but but at the same time those are the practical like limitations that the users are still running into like the users don't care if it's not performing well enough then yeah well and it turns out that ddr4 memory got faster and we look at that now it's like you know Amy's license to third-party integrated memory controller it looks like for present for Rison 3000 Verizon 3000 is Zen - but with these experts for and a for extra PCIe lines for MV me that's right sighs I think for the desktop you know triple-channel might have been nice but again not right size for business customers and volume customers now we look at where they've gone with thread Ripper and even for channels for channels for 32 cores really a bottleneck two channels for 16 cores no 12 channels are 12 cores 2 channels definitely not a bottleneck probably not going to be a bottleneck for 16 cores either although I'm gonna predict that the 16 core CPU is not going to be that much uplift over the twelfth court I'd love to be wrong but I just I think that because you don't get a larger cash you don't get any of the other benefits 12 cores with the giant cash that you get from two templates it's great and our 74 74 o2p with its giant cash because each triplet has six cores that's gonna be the sweet spot so of course of course AMD is going to come out with a 24 fourth Red River with 24 course to start 32 fours you know it's the the higher bandit chip le'ts which are going to go into the 39 50x and what you're going into the 3,800 X which you're selling really well and also the epic CPUs which are selling really well so there's not really any surprises there the surprise here is really you know Intel really just needs to let X 299 go and focus on 36 47 the the fabrication that they're doing like whatever like their fab capacity is strained just cut X 299 and do 36 47 9 higher K is enough for enthusiasts for now I mean eight tours it's really fast it's low latency concede that AMD has gotten you know sort of the mid market here with a hike or count and high multi-core performance and then with 36 47 you get six memory channels which is really it's a it's a nice sweet spot somewhere in between four and eight channels but it's nice sweet spot maybe that's why we've heard rumors about a and be doing something with 8 channels on the desktop don't know that's also unsubstantiated and we might not know until halfway there next year 36:47 he's got better PCIe Lane handling like this is the x2 note on orous gaming 9 half of the circuitry on this thing is to deal with cable 8 which only has 16 PCI Express Lanes then the CPU should have 28 PCI Express lines and then the CPUs that had 40 PCI Express lanes so us you all of that garbage and you make it so that AIB partners don't have to deal with your terrible business decisions I'm sorry Intel you really like you were trying to do market segmentation and has come back to haunt you the chickens have come home to roost and they did the inverse and they made it worse well not maybe not worse but so they they started with the kb lake being integrated index 299 which no.16 no one wanted and then they flipped it around and now they're you and it's it's mainly a market confusion thing but they have the 9900 K which is labeled as i9 in h EDT but it's not like no one understands why like if I say a nine ninety nine hundred K they're thinking it's this it's not this it doesn't have this and honestly this this may sound stupid because it couldn't work for technological reasons but I think some of the AMD boards can do it I would love to see it obviously isn't gonna happen temp gen but if they wanted to do like a weird hybrid enthusiast platform let's get the kind of optimizations and performance that the 99 hundred K has on a hybrid chipset that can do PCIe four and three that way you have like a single 4x slot and then the rest that is 4x4 nvme kind of throughput and then the rest of the slots of 3.0 because no one's using six like four or six 4.0 PCIe slots that who what are you plugging into it and what I want from a PI X five seventy board is to have seven full fledged slots I don't care that they're not all for a 4.0 I just want them all to be 16x so get one that's 4.0 split the rest off cuz everyone's like well you have the lanes you can just branch off into 3.0 or physically where am I going to put that so let's get loaded up on lanes load it up on nvme give everyone what 10 gig on board like you could really balance out your i/o in a way that would make a lot of people happy that's funny you mention that because there's also another issue with that I ran into doing XD ion testing and that his Intel's of B Rock virtual raid on chip so you everywhere yeah well you got I got one I got one of the things and I added it and it turns out that V Rock really wants you to use the onboard nvme but you're gonna be bottleneck and if you use an had in card you're not gonna be able to make those exposed to the cpu in all scenarios so again there is just it was a very anti consumer a lot of land mines and traps not well I advertise not well documented and not available and again I think that's because of paranoia of eating into the server market and it's like would you rather eat into the server market or would you rather it go to the competition that's really the place that you find yourself in now so you're gonna have to choose one of those things and one of those is worse for you than the other one so yeah again 36:47 direct CPU lanes it would work I actually did it right down so it's like okay X 299 what's the ideal PCIe layout 44 lights it's all we get to work with 8 lanes dedicated frame VMA so those are CPU lanes yes and the third nvme slot that's off the chipset so if you you get that third nvme it's gonna be slower probably but it's fine that would work for like your boot drive like most people don't need a fast food drive that'd be fine then you have your mom depending on your scenario but and then you have your actual like high bandwidth on the length you can actually do raid zero and it not be horribly slow we just get for video editing oh yeah 16x for the GPU another 8 X for GPU or another peripheral so you could run two GPUs so like if you're doing like two GPUs I think the sweet spot that we found for both premiere and resolved because resolve will actually support like four GPUs but it's diminishing returns without second GPU really benefits and for for game streaming purposes you can only do this on a chi GT in the first place you need that quad channel memory if you pop a second GPU on normal like what is the chipset zi 390 you literally just immediately lose performance and oh yes even if you're not using the second GPU for anything and so this is like they can they have people who are wanting to do dual GPU workflows on the normal consumer chipsets because that's just the light gamer II thing but they could like actually optimize for this on a CD T and it actually be like super beneficial for everybody creators Stringer's 3d work works for different - Forex slots for peripherals because capture cards and crap like that everything's more accident yeah and then you got 4x on board for onboard peripherals for things like onboard 10 gig or onboard peripherals that are on the motherboard that need more bandwidth that's all your legs let's you know forget 28 lines there but forget anything else I mean it's just you you got unity and we're out of lights we're literally out of lanes and that's only for peripherals which it friend is more you know content production type people this is really like sort of like the minimum and you look at like the other thing is is like you know innovations slowing down not really from the competition but like how many people out there are still rocking the Sandy Bridge like the i7 2700 K or they're buying like those first gen Sandy Bridge or even the same gen IV bridge Zeon's and repurposing those as an ORAC station how did that some of our early videos where you know like hey look at this workstation that I built for practically nothing and it's actually really good still even today this is just you know you're the silicon does get tweeks the silicon doesn't get updated new features are added to the silicon in the newer CPUs but so Sandy Bridge was 2013 that's a long time ago it feels like forever ago feels like it fits like 2003 so March 1983 the IBM pc/xt was released Martis 1987 widespread availability of the Intel i3 86 hit and by 1990 they were in production quantity of the 486 so from 83 to 90 we went from that the IBM pc/xt to the 486 that was huge huge I mean an explosion and from 2013 till now some people are like Sandy Bridge is still good enough it be likes people in 1990 saying IBM pc/xt still good enough is it home is it yeah would you rather buy a new i3 or a Sandy Bridge i7 a lot of the people that are watching mainstream channels like Jays desensitized tech tips and things like that these people are genuinely very excited about computer processors which like it's exciting for me buy carry sleep because it's like yeah it's the thing yeah I'm excited technology but people are excited about that because they see that we might see the same kind of generational leap that they've seen in their lifetime but they haven't seen recently and that's what's happening because there's competition in the market and so I think that's why Intel should just kill thanks to you now you know how you know be easier just cut the prices on the existing 9 Series chips looks like hey extra night is gonna be here for another year or two while working on these CPUs we're doing price cuts cuz it's been you know a couple of years since we released the 7000 series CP user and the 9000 series CPUs was just a refresh here have a price cut that's easier on integrators nobody has to spend even silicon it's not a marketing gag Marketing is not running the show these ubers aren't ticked off we're getting fed the same thing yeah and it's fine and we might see some people to refresh their X 299 motherboards with a little better PCIe layout but this particular board has a great PCIe layout except for the m2 which I'm sure was Intel specification behind us if you wanted to do vrock and you put it in the wrong end on two slots then you'd have a bad experience so I get why they did it but you know you're gonna end up running your your end up to in an add-in card and it sort of it's not problem on Linux but rigging that to get lean Rock actually does offer some benefits so it's frustrating and how that has been handled on the platform and I don't think anybody that's worked on it would disagree with me the only marketing people would probably disagree with so intel's got an opportunity to be like you know what x2 99s basically into life let's cut the prices let's focus on 3647 EVGA is ready asus is ready gigabytes ready as rocks ready why not and there's one other market which is out of the scope of this video but I wanted to bring up just as like a little nugget to think about where Intel is loot losing an even bigger consumer base because of their slow progress that's the arm we are seeing those generational gaps are like jumps in performance in certain use cases obviously not widespread desktop use through arm it is mind-blowing how fast video editing is on an iPad pro it's insane and we're gonna see within five years I'm gonna be generous and say within five not within like one but we're gonna see all of the Apple hardware shift to that just like they switched from the PowerPC to Intel to get that leap in the first place now they're saying goodbye to Intel going back to arm and it's gonna be insane Intel's gonna get slaughtered on that department and then the PC people are gonna be like why can't we do that I'm already confused why my ex $2.99 system edits slower than an iPad there's a lot of ifs ands buts and gotchas with 100% way much more nuance there but there's a little bit that just really makes you start to think yeah so XD ion is dead let it die this generation like if you're gonna buy a new audience do 99 yeah 36:47 just just get one of the 36 for EVGA where can i buy that you know we saw it six months ago plus like working I buy it I need to buy it you can buy the you buy the Dominus in the gigabyte or s 3647 a c6 21 on a new egg but there's this look the only two and they cost over $1000 it's almost $2,000 for the board which makes sense in the in low-volume come on Oh so again Intel's you know I love Intel they're gonna they're sleeping giant and they're waking up now which is great I've got a lot of smart people working form and they are going to spend a lot of money I'm sure shareholders are not gonna be happy about that but I'm happy that they're spending the money to get the job done because they're gonna deliver some amazing amazing products I just need to balance the silence and not releasing something new versus reiterating the same product over and over in the meantime because they might actually be able to make faster progress if they stopped redeveloping the same chips I'd love to be wrong about next $2.99 but I can't imagine x-29 CPU that's gonna make me excited I'm keeping my I'm keeping my motherboards if I can slap something in there that me I'll do it but 19 doesn't leave me much later than that it's exciting all right we'll see you later I guess we should do like the big youtuber outro smash that like button if you want to tick down and tell comment down below if you love AMD subscribe to us if I don't yes so yeah it's deep postal box there's a link this is level 1 it's fine I don't know level 1 forums description below he has more experience YouTube meringue than I do I'm just here see youso it turns out that X 299 is dead I think like I just it's dead mine's dead you've gotta send me down a DX e that we deleted and we squeezed as much performance as possible out of it I think Intel was wasting everybody's time thanks to 99 I mean I love Intel I love their like AMD has woken them up the slumbering giant is like oh wait we can squeeze more performance out of silicon oh we didn't realize so something's gonna be really awesome before too long maybe next year maybe the year after we'd want after that but x2 now I'm Lucy for you so on X 9 is wasting everybody's time we're gonna talk about why ya only v speak in absolutes yeah pretty much except for now I mean mostly change that policy yeah mostly it's true that there probably are some nice cat use cases for X 299 but it's really frustrating because x2 now 9 should have probably you know stop with seventh generation eighth generation should ease us into something else you might be thinking but wait there's nothing past x2 99 that's not true there's 36:47 there's always more it's not what we're given you know in the store you get it in servers and so we actually did see 36 47 not this past Computex in June of 2019 but in June of 2018 yeah we're going going into q4 of 2019 intel promised us almost a year ago the W 3175 X which actually is in stock at Newegg at the time we're doing this but I got to get a $1600 board and the cpu costs $3,000 and the motherboard is you know like this big yeah and has like two power supplies worth of hookups like there's a lot of sacrifices you have to make to use that much power although with how much I've put in on my 79 ATX II honestly anything's looking great at the moment I'm like the guy lock lock lock the desert that's walking through looking at mirages and just trying to figure out you know what the best processor is I'm pretty sure you could just throw me like a quad-core and I'm gonna think it's better if it's cooler is it emanating heat into my brain you can have 10 gigahertz but only four cords or twenty eight cores but only one Giga this is basically the choice I mean it's really true and this is this video we're gonna talk a little bit about AMD and what AMD is doing but really only in the context of like forcing Intel's hand and X to 99 as a refresh like we don't even have any inside info I don't know I don't know what's coming up I'm expecting like a clock bump and we'll talk about hypotheticals and that kind of thing but I just don't see how Intel could possibly pull a rabbit out of a hat with X 299 it's too limited in terms of single thread performance it's too limited in terms of clock speed it's too limited in terms of PCIe lanes the motherboards already out there there's not a chipset refresh so what's happening and like yeah what we're gonna get is gonna beat the ten ninety and ten nine eighty x II it's still gonna be soldered it's gonna be like 3.9 gigahertz and it's the same core count in the same heat and maybe one little extra feature but with none of the motherboards being really all that adaptable we're at least past the point of getting all the you know you only get this mini PCIe lanes with this chip and this Smitty with this ship like we're past that point but it's all going to fit and in seventh gen 79-80 was an amazing processor like I remember all of the hyper on it that's why I was so excited to have it in my system but three years later I'm begging someone to take it away from me so you really have to look at like the history of the 2011 socket and the 2011 socket really got started with Sandy Bridge but they tweaked it they tweaked it around I think brought well and so you have these Zeon's like the e5 2680 v3 and v4 those are legendary CPUs and I mention them specifically because basically tweaked versions of that is what we got for some of these high-end desktop processors it's just the on three badges I haven't unlocked maybe with some other tweaks and features and I don't want to minimize that I mean Intel's done a lot of work in that not necessarily on the silicon but qualification and testing and a lot of QA and QC that really honestly Intel's competition probably could learn from just a little bit in terms of you know testing and integration and that kind of thing but it's it's come to the socket is overdue so like when that socket stops being relevant in a server space Intel can still get some more money out of their tooling and the AIB partners can get some money out of their tooling they can repurpose some of those server boards as enthusiast boards as desktop boards and I get it it makes sense and that was really appealing at first like that was the cool part is there's a you know there was a plethora of reasons that you couldn't necessarily use some of the server boards or the server chips in a desktop environment directly without making some sacrifices and some little things and Intel put into work to make that usable and allowed some of us that were you know googling over or googling over the the sr2 motherboards the dual socket like gaming motherboards that were basically vaporware and wishing we had those in our system like that was when I first got into tech YouTube they kind of made that a reality and that was really cool but AMD has come in and done that better and it's you can't just keep rerelease it it's no longer impressive anymore like the scrappy little underdog with a tenth of the resources who's come in and like something has clearly Dolf gone wrong here because and thread report it's are now basically just epic chips and the epic chips are really really good I like I mean Intel has some of the most intelligent people working for it and they have basically a limitless supply of money so those are not the problems there's got to be so I know as we talked about like fabrication engineering you know things like that I just think that Intel sort of gave up I mean that they looked at it and they were like we're hitting the limits with the laws of physics we can violate the laws of physics and it's like okay we'll just go in a different direction to find a workaround and their competition has done that and a competition and tsmc more than I envy I think has done that because Amy's at the mercy of the foundries it's not really it's a name the tsmc partnership thing but this is not really a MV versus Intel it's really TSM C+ GlobalFoundries plus samsung plus other people versus Intel so it's like all of these companies working to try to come up with a better fabrication process than Intel leading to a better product but look at how well Intel does I mean if we look at the 9900 K the cache size is tiny it is really really tiny the cache size on on AMD is mammoth and it takes a mammoth amount of cash to compete with Intel if Intel's got you know engineering that's so good that they only need a fraction of the cash to compete with AMD then imagine what will happen when Intel really you know sort of gets their engineers out and engineers get in engineering mode which is I think we're seeing with Jim Keller and some of the other people that product is really exciting that product is not X 299 that's why I think extra money on is dead Intel couldn't do something different like I mean obviously it takes a fabrication capacity and some engineering into a PC to release another round of X 299 processors but you might be thinking we don't have enthusiast server motherboards we don't have enthusiast 36:47 motherboards it's too late we need to put a lot of engineering time into those you're wrong you're wrong at site because we already had the Dominus motherboard get the Dominus motherboard and the Auris extreme motherboard from gigabyte we know those exist we saw those at context but also we've got surfer motherboards we got you know as rock rack has some really incredible server motherboards they even get up an ITX sort of motherboard I saw that on Linus tech tips oh yeah on the internet and in servers and places like that so it's a server motherboard 3647 you can take that as a starting point and start customizing it it's not like you're reinventing the wheel the new Mac Pro's the iMac Pro is x2 99 which is kind of funny cuz it's like and I'm at pros kind of a toy but the new Mac Pro's actually used 3647 it s use all this nonsense which is a waste of everybody's time at this point and like especially with all of you know there's been a lot of videos trying to beat Apple's Mac Pro or whatever if we could get that motherboard and like a consumer you know that you could buy on its own it would be an amazing platform like the Mac Pro is an amazing platform Apple miss aside and we could get a lot of that and that's that's what a lot of us have wanted out of it out of the enthusiasts stuff and that was a lot of the energy that was turned up you know on the enthusiast side was can we take all of this cut off some of the enterprise stuff that we're not using and just go ham with the specs and I one way they went a ham with the specs was visa is because the Mac Pro has 64 PCI Express lanes it's not a PLA exploit or anything like that Intel looks like Intel reuse the quickpath interconnect which is normally what you would use for a to socket system they use some of those interface interconnects to just repurpose them as PCI Express Lanes which is fine 64 PCI Express Lanes at 36 47 sounds like a great workstation chip to me that's honestly been a lot of especially on the workstation side gaming sides obviously a little different most people don't care but on the workstation enthusiast side the lane limitation has been one of the biggest like hurdles for them to overcome and 44 sounds like enough but you start running into issues with the nvme layout you have all of the nvme routed through the single DMI that is choking when you're trying to use like kinds of like throughput that I'm trying to put my system through it sounds great I can get for nvme drives on my ex 299 built which is bonkers but they all perform like one nvme drive or or less or left communicate between them because of the overhead and even less if you're using qlc drives like I made the mistake of doing a couple with and I drives that oops yeah um but it's getting choked whereas none of that issue happens on certain other if we look at what AMD is doing they've got their server socket and their desktop socket and when Roslyn first came out I was kind of critical to desktop sake I was like I would have liked to have seen triple channel memory you know I would have liked to see more maybe four more PCI Express Lanes we went from 16 to 20 plus 4 for the chipset which then breaks out and now on a m4 because of PCI Express 4.0 those PCI Express lanes go a lot farther I was not expecting PCI Express 4 on Zen - I was maybe Zen 3 but that's not gonna be a m4 and here we've got PCI Express 4 on a m4 that really changes the game 32 cores you know with the threader 432 core everybody was saying there wasn't enough memory bandwidth so 16 cores with dual channel looked like it wasn't gonna be enough memory bandwidth let's move thought it was Windows I forget I got I always work that in so it's like us but but at the same time those are the practical like limitations that the users are still running into like the users don't care if it's not performing well enough then yeah well and it turns out that ddr4 memory got faster and we look at that now it's like you know Amy's license to third-party integrated memory controller it looks like for present for Rison 3000 Verizon 3000 is Zen - but with these experts for and a for extra PCIe lines for MV me that's right sighs I think for the desktop you know triple-channel might have been nice but again not right size for business customers and volume customers now we look at where they've gone with thread Ripper and even for channels for channels for 32 cores really a bottleneck two channels for 16 cores no 12 channels are 12 cores 2 channels definitely not a bottleneck probably not going to be a bottleneck for 16 cores either although I'm gonna predict that the 16 core CPU is not going to be that much uplift over the twelfth court I'd love to be wrong but I just I think that because you don't get a larger cash you don't get any of the other benefits 12 cores with the giant cash that you get from two templates it's great and our 74 74 o2p with its giant cash because each triplet has six cores that's gonna be the sweet spot so of course of course AMD is going to come out with a 24 fourth Red River with 24 course to start 32 fours you know it's the the higher bandit chip le'ts which are going to go into the 39 50x and what you're going into the 3,800 X which you're selling really well and also the epic CPUs which are selling really well so there's not really any surprises there the surprise here is really you know Intel really just needs to let X 299 go and focus on 36 47 the the fabrication that they're doing like whatever like their fab capacity is strained just cut X 299 and do 36 47 9 higher K is enough for enthusiasts for now I mean eight tours it's really fast it's low latency concede that AMD has gotten you know sort of the mid market here with a hike or count and high multi-core performance and then with 36 47 you get six memory channels which is really it's a it's a nice sweet spot somewhere in between four and eight channels but it's nice sweet spot maybe that's why we've heard rumors about a and be doing something with 8 channels on the desktop don't know that's also unsubstantiated and we might not know until halfway there next year 36:47 he's got better PCIe Lane handling like this is the x2 note on orous gaming 9 half of the circuitry on this thing is to deal with cable 8 which only has 16 PCI Express Lanes then the CPU should have 28 PCI Express lines and then the CPUs that had 40 PCI Express lanes so us you all of that garbage and you make it so that AIB partners don't have to deal with your terrible business decisions I'm sorry Intel you really like you were trying to do market segmentation and has come back to haunt you the chickens have come home to roost and they did the inverse and they made it worse well not maybe not worse but so they they started with the kb lake being integrated index 299 which no.16 no one wanted and then they flipped it around and now they're you and it's it's mainly a market confusion thing but they have the 9900 K which is labeled as i9 in h EDT but it's not like no one understands why like if I say a nine ninety nine hundred K they're thinking it's this it's not this it doesn't have this and honestly this this may sound stupid because it couldn't work for technological reasons but I think some of the AMD boards can do it I would love to see it obviously isn't gonna happen temp gen but if they wanted to do like a weird hybrid enthusiast platform let's get the kind of optimizations and performance that the 99 hundred K has on a hybrid chipset that can do PCIe four and three that way you have like a single 4x slot and then the rest that is 4x4 nvme kind of throughput and then the rest of the slots of 3.0 because no one's using six like four or six 4.0 PCIe slots that who what are you plugging into it and what I want from a PI X five seventy board is to have seven full fledged slots I don't care that they're not all for a 4.0 I just want them all to be 16x so get one that's 4.0 split the rest off cuz everyone's like well you have the lanes you can just branch off into 3.0 or physically where am I going to put that so let's get loaded up on lanes load it up on nvme give everyone what 10 gig on board like you could really balance out your i/o in a way that would make a lot of people happy that's funny you mention that because there's also another issue with that I ran into doing XD ion testing and that his Intel's of B Rock virtual raid on chip so you everywhere yeah well you got I got one I got one of the things and I added it and it turns out that V Rock really wants you to use the onboard nvme but you're gonna be bottleneck and if you use an had in card you're not gonna be able to make those exposed to the cpu in all scenarios so again there is just it was a very anti consumer a lot of land mines and traps not well I advertise not well documented and not available and again I think that's because of paranoia of eating into the server market and it's like would you rather eat into the server market or would you rather it go to the competition that's really the place that you find yourself in now so you're gonna have to choose one of those things and one of those is worse for you than the other one so yeah again 36:47 direct CPU lanes it would work I actually did it right down so it's like okay X 299 what's the ideal PCIe layout 44 lights it's all we get to work with 8 lanes dedicated frame VMA so those are CPU lanes yes and the third nvme slot that's off the chipset so if you you get that third nvme it's gonna be slower probably but it's fine that would work for like your boot drive like most people don't need a fast food drive that'd be fine then you have your mom depending on your scenario but and then you have your actual like high bandwidth on the length you can actually do raid zero and it not be horribly slow we just get for video editing oh yeah 16x for the GPU another 8 X for GPU or another peripheral so you could run two GPUs so like if you're doing like two GPUs I think the sweet spot that we found for both premiere and resolved because resolve will actually support like four GPUs but it's diminishing returns without second GPU really benefits and for for game streaming purposes you can only do this on a chi GT in the first place you need that quad channel memory if you pop a second GPU on normal like what is the chipset zi 390 you literally just immediately lose performance and oh yes even if you're not using the second GPU for anything and so this is like they can they have people who are wanting to do dual GPU workflows on the normal consumer chipsets because that's just the light gamer II thing but they could like actually optimize for this on a CD T and it actually be like super beneficial for everybody creators Stringer's 3d work works for different - Forex slots for peripherals because capture cards and crap like that everything's more accident yeah and then you got 4x on board for onboard peripherals for things like onboard 10 gig or onboard peripherals that are on the motherboard that need more bandwidth that's all your legs let's you know forget 28 lines there but forget anything else I mean it's just you you got unity and we're out of lights we're literally out of lanes and that's only for peripherals which it friend is more you know content production type people this is really like sort of like the minimum and you look at like the other thing is is like you know innovations slowing down not really from the competition but like how many people out there are still rocking the Sandy Bridge like the i7 2700 K or they're buying like those first gen Sandy Bridge or even the same gen IV bridge Zeon's and repurposing those as an ORAC station how did that some of our early videos where you know like hey look at this workstation that I built for practically nothing and it's actually really good still even today this is just you know you're the silicon does get tweeks the silicon doesn't get updated new features are added to the silicon in the newer CPUs but so Sandy Bridge was 2013 that's a long time ago it feels like forever ago feels like it fits like 2003 so March 1983 the IBM pc/xt was released Martis 1987 widespread availability of the Intel i3 86 hit and by 1990 they were in production quantity of the 486 so from 83 to 90 we went from that the IBM pc/xt to the 486 that was huge huge I mean an explosion and from 2013 till now some people are like Sandy Bridge is still good enough it be likes people in 1990 saying IBM pc/xt still good enough is it home is it yeah would you rather buy a new i3 or a Sandy Bridge i7 a lot of the people that are watching mainstream channels like Jays desensitized tech tips and things like that these people are genuinely very excited about computer processors which like it's exciting for me buy carry sleep because it's like yeah it's the thing yeah I'm excited technology but people are excited about that because they see that we might see the same kind of generational leap that they've seen in their lifetime but they haven't seen recently and that's what's happening because there's competition in the market and so I think that's why Intel should just kill thanks to you now you know how you know be easier just cut the prices on the existing 9 Series chips looks like hey extra night is gonna be here for another year or two while working on these CPUs we're doing price cuts cuz it's been you know a couple of years since we released the 7000 series CP user and the 9000 series CPUs was just a refresh here have a price cut that's easier on integrators nobody has to spend even silicon it's not a marketing gag Marketing is not running the show these ubers aren't ticked off we're getting fed the same thing yeah and it's fine and we might see some people to refresh their X 299 motherboards with a little better PCIe layout but this particular board has a great PCIe layout except for the m2 which I'm sure was Intel specification behind us if you wanted to do vrock and you put it in the wrong end on two slots then you'd have a bad experience so I get why they did it but you know you're gonna end up running your your end up to in an add-in card and it sort of it's not problem on Linux but rigging that to get lean Rock actually does offer some benefits so it's frustrating and how that has been handled on the platform and I don't think anybody that's worked on it would disagree with me the only marketing people would probably disagree with so intel's got an opportunity to be like you know what x2 99s basically into life let's cut the prices let's focus on 3647 EVGA is ready asus is ready gigabytes ready as rocks ready why not and there's one other market which is out of the scope of this video but I wanted to bring up just as like a little nugget to think about where Intel is loot losing an even bigger consumer base because of their slow progress that's the arm we are seeing those generational gaps are like jumps in performance in certain use cases obviously not widespread desktop use through arm it is mind-blowing how fast video editing is on an iPad pro it's insane and we're gonna see within five years I'm gonna be generous and say within five not within like one but we're gonna see all of the Apple hardware shift to that just like they switched from the PowerPC to Intel to get that leap in the first place now they're saying goodbye to Intel going back to arm and it's gonna be insane Intel's gonna get slaughtered on that department and then the PC people are gonna be like why can't we do that I'm already confused why my ex $2.99 system edits slower than an iPad there's a lot of ifs ands buts and gotchas with 100% way much more nuance there but there's a little bit that just really makes you start to think yeah so XD ion is dead let it die this generation like if you're gonna buy a new audience do 99 yeah 36:47 just just get one of the 36 for EVGA where can i buy that you know we saw it six months ago plus like working I buy it I need to buy it you can buy the you buy the Dominus in the gigabyte or s 3647 a c6 21 on a new egg but there's this look the only two and they cost over $1000 it's almost $2,000 for the board which makes sense in the in low-volume come on Oh so again Intel's you know I love Intel they're gonna they're sleeping giant and they're waking up now which is great I've got a lot of smart people working form and they are going to spend a lot of money I'm sure shareholders are not gonna be happy about that but I'm happy that they're spending the money to get the job done because they're gonna deliver some amazing amazing products I just need to balance the silence and not releasing something new versus reiterating the same product over and over in the meantime because they might actually be able to make faster progress if they stopped redeveloping the same chips I'd love to be wrong about next $2.99 but I can't imagine x-29 CPU that's gonna make me excited I'm keeping my I'm keeping my motherboards if I can slap something in there that me I'll do it but 19 doesn't leave me much later than that it's exciting all right we'll see you later I guess we should do like the big youtuber outro smash that like button if you want to tick down and tell comment down below if you love AMD subscribe to us if I don't yes so yeah it's deep postal box there's a link this is level 1 it's fine I don't know level 1 forums description below he has more experience YouTube meringue than I do I'm just here see you\n"