**The Evolution of Augmented Reality and its Impact on Technology**

When it comes to augmented reality (AR), there's been a lot of buzz about how big companies can implement AR technology to get benefits back. To make AR useful, you need to find a way to make it pay off for businesses. In the 90s, Apple was one of the pioneers in AR technology with QuickTime VR. They had some great ideas, like showing users around a Volkswagen New Beetle, but it wasn't until later that they figured out how to use it effectively. The concept of AR is basically just taking that idea and sinking up to the camera so you see this 3D model in real space.

However, Apple's early attempts with QuickTime VR only worked on Macs and struggled to work on other devices. Meanwhile, Google was working behind the scenes to develop their own version of AR technology. They took some of the ideas from Apple and turned them into something new. By creating a node where you could look around 360 degrees in a panorama, click a button, and go ahead to another space, they basically created a non-linear movie experience. This idea later became known as Google Street View, which allowed users to explore maps and locations in a completely new way.

Fast forward to today, Apple is now using their own technology to create a more advanced AR experience. They've taken the concept of Street View and made it even better, with 3D models and textured surfaces that give you an immersive experience. With this new technology, users can explore maps in a way that feels like they're actually there. And with Apple's latest Maps update, it seems like we'll finally see some real change. The company has been aggressive in their efforts to modernize Maps across the entire United States, and it will be exciting to see how this plays out.

**The Future of AR and What's Next**

One thing that's clear is that AR is going to play a big role in the future of technology. But what exactly does that mean? Apple has been developing some cutting-edge technologies that aren't quite clear yet, but are likely to be game-changers when they're finally released. From vehicles to other unknown applications, it seems like Apple is trying to solve some major problems with their latest innovations.

The key thing to take away from all of this is that AR technology is still evolving, and we're just starting to see the real benefits. Whether you're a tech enthusiast or just someone who loves looking around at cool stuff, there's no denying that AR has the potential to change the way we live and interact with the world around us.

**Upcoming Developments**

In the meantime, if you're in the market for some new Wi-Fi technology, now is the perfect time. Netgear's latest line of Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 routers are a great option for anyone looking to upgrade their home network. With these routers, you can enjoy buffer-free streaming and zero lag, no matter how many devices are connected to your network. Whether you're gaming online or watching Netflix in 4K, these routers will give you the VIP treatment that you deserve.

Upgrading your Wi-Fi router is easier than ever, thanks to Netgear's user-friendly interface. And with their promise of "make your Wi-Fi feel young again," you can rest assured that you'll be getting a top-notch network that will keep up with all your streaming needs. So why wait? Upgrade your Wi-Fi today and experience the difference for yourself.

**About the Author**

Daniel Aaron is a writer for Apple Insider, where he covers the latest developments in technology and innovation. You can find his articles on Roughly Drafted and follow him on Twitter at @DanelAaron.

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enyou're listening to the Apple Insider podcast all right welcome back to this episode of the Apple Insider podcast I'm Victor and joining me is Daniel eron diler from WWDC good morning from San Jose how is San Jose uh it's quite nice it got pretty hot so no need to wear a jacket most of the time except inside the conference Hall some of them are refrigerated to the point of needing to put on the on the jacket wow well at least they gave out jackets right yeah they they had a like a bomber jacket and there's several different kinds each has a different color it's a similar print but it's a different primary color so makes everybody kind of brightly a bright bunch of people yeah but that's not what listeners are here for right that's that's not one of our audience is talking about is the jacket because what they really want to know about is is what the heck is going on there right we we saw this very very big cheese grater Mac Pro we saw the Monitor and the monitor stand and a whole bunch of other things so let's start talking about that tell me about the Mac Pro well Apple took I mean wwc is obviously for developers it's where this whole Conference of they're talking about what's new and their new operating systems and the reason why the pro was announced as Hardware it's not common that there's Hardware released um but this is a product that Apple hasn't uh updated again since since 2014 I think and there were several years where it was the the can size which I think everybody realizes was sort of a mistake I mean they they created this product that was almost like a consumer product that was you know looked cute and everything but it wasn't really expandable in the way that Pro people needed wanted and so here they're kind of coming back to the design similar to the aluminum Max that came out in what 2005 or 2003 uh right the the old Power G5 yeah yeah so it's a more modular design I mean it's more of a typical kind of PC type design where you have a tremendous number of slots huge amounts of uh expansion potential using PCI you also have Thunderbolt which is basic PCI in the form of a cable um so it allows you to do very powerful things uh that's that's Apple's expansion uh interconnect basically for the MacBook Pros you can plug in multiple displays and all kinds of other things and raid devices and everything so you have both of those things on the Mac Pro uh you have you know the Bing architecture and the processors that it's using are are they're kind of overkill for most people they're they're very high-end and so it's also an expensive machine uh but so they showed that off along with a monitor which Apple doesn't really sell monitors anymore but this is doing things that you can't do with most other devices out there I mean they kind of highlighted that there was no other device that hit all the check boxs that they wanted to deliver and particularly for people who are doing 4K video so it's or um yes working with any kind of high-end video and audio and um working with tons of tracks and so the really positioning the Mac platform is being able to handle really complex tasks and workflows for Professionals for whom the price is and the primary consideration is it's a capability so this is not for consumers you know when consumers look at and they're like wow $5,000 for a Macintosh to begin with uh and then you know goes up dramatically this is not for people you know doing Excel spreadsheets this is for people who are making money with their machine yeah this is not imov right this this is something other than that right I mean Apple has their own Pro apps and they have a developer community of who make Pro apps and there's other uh developers that in other ways service people who are working in pro professional environments like that so it is relevant to developers and that's why it was presented here because they're showing that this is things you can do with our platform and now with the future we're going to be building out this this is not something that's going to sell in the you know tens of millions like iOS devices sell um so it's a very different Market but it is important for developers who work with those kinds of clients or who themselves have really crushing workflows that they need to have huge hardware for you know recompiling software and uh in huge huge environments where you're doing really complex things it's the Mac Pro is relevant to them in both directions let me ask there's there's a couple of things that stuck out to me as being interesting and unique there um one of them was after burner and the other was what looked to me to be extensions or modifications on the PCI slot can you talk to a little bit about afterburner afterburner is an optional uh card that is a fpga basically a it's basically a chip that can be programmed to do a variety of things after the fact and so there it's it's a A specialized type of processor that lets you um reprogram how it works and so Apple's initially using it to radically um speed up how fast it can do Graphics operations um I don't know what else I haven't really looked at that really closely I'm I think there's a lot of machine learning kind of compute tasks that can also handle but um what it really reminded me of was if you remember the old next Cube they had the next Dimension board that just it was I think it was maybe more expensive than the motherboard but you put it in and it just like raised the the hardware capacity of the machine just this incredible extent using specialized chips that were had you know was kind of brand new technology it's kind of along the those lines of you can put in uh you can put in sort of conventional gpus or this is a a special card that Apple's offering to really dramatically improve the performance of pro workflows now it's interesting that you brought up next because one of the other things WWDC is for is is all of the software changes for developers and it sort of occurred to me that this is is a seismic shift as a year goes as WWDC goes because it feels in a way like all of the things that were carried over from next are going away you know there's no more interface Builder project Builder that that uh the whole app kit UI kit shift that's taking place with swift UI do you sort of understand what I'm asking or what I'm saying here well um yeah conceptually it's kind of the same thing though because a lot of what next was trying to achieve and remember next was the company that Steve JS founded after he left Apple in the mid 80s so the late 80s um he called it next because it was basically the next thing after what Apple was doing in the 80s with the Macintosh and so at the beginning of the 90s they were roll at this computer of the future with an operating system of the future and a number of things that it attempted to do was to make programming easier to make graphics just tremendously more advanced where you're compositing on the screen instead of just working with B maps and a lot of the things that that it conceptually started are things that Apple later um turned into Mac OS 10 and they changed a lot of that too they they refreshed it because it was like almost 10 years later and here we are 20 years after that you know Mac OS 10 is almost 20 years old and so they're taking a lot of the ideas and bringing them into the future so the interface Builder what it was was a tool for basically generating code from a graphical uh tool so you lay out interfaces quickly and see how they worked um and at the time it was kind of revolutionary uh now it's it's not hasn't been for a while U and some of the tools that Apple's building uh have superseded what it can do but particularly what they're what they introduced this year was Swift UI which is a uh it's built upon the work that they've been doing with swift their new programming language that you know new it's five years old I think now but they're constantly working on uh developing a a language that can handle kind of the needs of the future and also dramatically uh reduce the amount of code you need to do a lot of things because the less code you have the less opportunity you have for mistakes and less things you have to correct so the the biggest demonstration they showed was for doing lists and and on on Mac OS 10 using um conventional development tools uh with Objective C if you look at Objective C code it's kind of difficult to read um it you have to very uh specifically put things in a in a very verbose kind of description of how you want your how you you want to build your interface with swift UI what it's doing is it's using the power of the switch language to um pair down a lot of the work that you're doing so that not only does it require less code to do kind of simple things like laying out a a listing of things on your on an iPhone screen that you can interact with but then it adds a lot of other functionality for free so once you do this you lay it out in this very descriptive way then the operating system and the the framework underneath it is handling a lot of the work that they're doing behind the scenes already for things like dark mode um which is a lot more complicated than just turning black to white or inverting colors there's a lot of thought that goes into the user interface in terms of like layers of how do you make how how do you let the user feel grounded and understand what's happening in animations and and all these kind of things so there's a lot of complexity for if Apple just said here's what we want it to look like and developers you do it then everyone's implementation would look a little bit different and it wouldn't be consistent and it would be a tremendous amount of work for every developer to be doing so a lot of what Apple does in terms of their platform is do all that work that's common amongst applications so that developers can focus on what they're trying to do so they get things like dark mode sort of for free when they're building with swift UI and it also works it does um things related to supporting other languages there's a lot of developers who don't you know maybe they don't know Arabic and Hebrew and they don't understand what's involved with right to left languages and so this is something that handles that kind of stuff for them um so it's kind of a progression of of what the Macintosh first delivered and then what next kind of pushed ahead and so now they're you know they're pushing the same kind of Concepts ahead in modern ways using modern tools and the modern um languages so conceptually it's kind of the same but yes it is replacing in the same way that you know QuickTime was replaced by AV kit and or AV Tools uh and everything that we kind of knew of as sort of a brand name eventually kind of goes away and is replaced by a modern version of what that was one of the things that I was thinking when I saw Swift UI was the idea that the the device becomes just a de Target and and so I was thinking about the possibility of being able to use Swift UI to write for the web for example sort of as a as a sort of modern web objects kind of idea I I don't see that there's a plan to do that um so part of the web is very useful in some ways and it's you know it's kind of obvious that how ways is useful but it's Al not useful in a number of ways and one of the things that we've kind of learned is that when you write for the web you're write you're not writing for you're writing for every browser anyone can ever think of and as that changes and as um you know originally was Microsoft they kind of controlled the web browser and they introduced whatever they wanted to introduce and then when there was more fractionization between different browsers it became more work to figure out how to do it and it was this effort to have all these standard bodies that were doing this thing together and then you have somebody else saying like hey we you know we like working with a standard body but we have a much better way to do this other thing and so they you know that's a lot of what Google is doing now with their browser is kind of like establishing themselves as the new Microsoft where they're doing a lot of things that just don't work on other browsers because Google has done something that to support you know really complex web applications and so the a lot of the open promise of the web is is just not possible to deliver someone's going to be in control of it and if you look at apps a lot of what apple is doing with apps is native it's native code that's running optimized for a specific device so on the Mac it was like Mac app is software that's designed for Macintosh and it takes very optimized use of the hardware and everything on it and it looks really nice and that's the whole thing you know works like a Mac or has this Mac look and feel software 4 um when iOS came out they developed an entirely new kind of Paradigm of software of how it interacts and everything that made sense on a small device and a touch interface and that they did the same thing you know on a little bit bigger scale with the iPad and added other features that only make sense on a device that's that big and with the premise of the web is you could build something that looks great on all of them but it doesn't we already know that web apps don't look there's a lot of disadvantages to using the web for going across platform because it's not optimized for anything and so what Apple really established they they kind of turn back this thought that everything was going to the web and Google for example is very web company that that's how they reach everybody is that they put it on a web interface and there are some advantages to doing things like that but for consumers in particular and also for pro pro users there's tremendous advantages when you have something designed so that your hardware and your software designed together to work together optimally and it's not just trying to have some sort of open thing that it's doing in a web browser so they're they're very useful things we do on the web but for most users if they have a choice between a web app and a native app they're going to choose the app because it works better and there's a lot of things you can do in an app that just don't work really well on a on a browser and a lot of browser efforts are trying to make something that's basically so complicated that or so sophisticated and complex that it's becoming like an app a native app that runs on a program so a lot of the work that Apple's doing with its platforms are really competing with the web so when Apple makes a tool it's not making a tool to also put them on the web because the features the the things that they would have to do to make at work would also destroy the value of what they actually did to make it exist all right thank thanks for answering that I know I was thinking out there a little ahead but uh and a little out there but it seemed like a thought because one of the things that we've talked about on this show in the past weeks have been things like project marzipan which I think is now Catalyst and and trying to figure out you know our iPad apps coming to the Mac what happens to what we traditionally think of as a Mac app and how does this puzzle piece fit together how does that work so the the framework for developing Mac apps which has been in place since Mac OS 10 is called appkit or yeah it's called out kit and when they developed when they basically turned when they came out with the iPhone the iPhone was basically Mac OS 10 in the shape of a mobile device but instead of calling it Macos 10 they gave it another another um name and they optimized a lot of the Frameworks so when you're building applications for an iPhone there's certain things that just don't make sense from the Mac so they got rid of those there are things that make sense on a phone that didn't make sense on the Mac so they original implementations and also because they're doing all this work they're they're rewriting this from scratch they can fix a lot of things that um could be done better than they were on the Mac And so there's a little bit of technology that washes back and forth where they do something on the iPhone and they bring it to the Mac for example the animation kit that does all the nice animations for you when Windows move around and things that was brought back to the mac and then there's also things that were created on the Mac that have come to the iPhone now we're now in in you know 10 years into iOS and there's been a lot of talk of how they going to converge the two and make them the same thing and there's a number of reasons kind of like what we're talking about the web that you don't want to do that there's there should be separate platforms I would argue there even becoming more separate right now with the introduction of iPad OS right I mean they kind of hinted that before when they came out with you know tvos and watch OS and it's like why do they have these different names they're really just iOS but they have optimizations and the point of giving it a different name is that there's a different interaction model that's significant enough to where it kind of needs its own name so that even though there's a lot of similarities there's a lot of things that are exactly the same um the way that you interact with a TV using a remote control is is very different than if you have a piece of glass that you're touching like an iPhone or an iPad and with the iPad and iPhone there's enough difference there because you have such a big difference in screen real state that you can do a lot of things with drag and drop and kind of working with multiple documents next to each other that do it's a little too cramped on a phone to make sense and so like you're saying they're they're making these different buckets so you can talk about them individually in a way that makes sense um now for iPhone and iPad there have been similar enough that they were given the same name until this year um and when you develop when you're building an app it's kind of another checkbox that you Mark and you say I want this app to also work on the iPad and then you can customize things to your iPad app that make it um make sense on an iPad what list is is another checkbox that says I want this app that works great on iPad to work on a Mac it's not emulation it's not hosting it in like a a VM or something it's not a simulator it's a real thing right so what what it does it takes your app your um on the on iOS apps are built with uiit which is just the the analog of um appkit right and they're compiled for an arm processor right so what it does is it um builds that app for the mac and on the Mac side they've built the Frameworks behind it to support that and additionally when you when you create when you take an iPad app and you make it work on the Mac which Apple first demonstrated on some of their own apps last year um and now they're doing with things like podcasts when you bring them that Mac app to the Mac it's a Mac app it was built with a little bit different tools but it doesn't make it look different it doesn't make it behave different say it's not supposed to be different and users aren't even supposed to notice it's just an app that works on the system um it was just built with a little bit different tools and the way that developers create those apps is you know procedurally a little bit different but it creates native apps and so the point is there are a million iPad apps that are customized for iPads and a lot of those would make sense to bring to the Mac however because if you have a team for example Twitter that has an iPhone app and has an iPad app for them to build an a Mac app before this year they would have to start over an appkit and do things radically different so it's a totally different program it's almost I mean it's not quite as much difference as you know building an out for Windows well it's actually a really good example signicant different it's it's a good example I was reading that someone looked at at Twitter and they they' estimated that Twitter for Mac when it was still Twitter for Mac in its last release had something like 990,000 lines of code and that Twitter for iOS has something like 1.56 million that that they've diverged that much from when they had a Mac app and an IOS app that were more similar and yeah anytime you have two different code bases they they're going to progress separately and there's it's a totally different project yeah so what Catalyst does is allows you to take the work all these companies have already put invested tremendous amounts of effort into iOS it allows them to take their work and make it into a Mac app that works like a Mac app and they can additionally add on to it Mac features that are unique to the Mac the same way that I iPad apps have features that don't work on an iPhone because they different you know different in scale and different in features and what they can do and so with Catalyst it allows teams that have like a an iOS code base to bring that to the Mac so there's millions of there's at least a million iPad apps that are already customized for iPad that a lot of those make sense on the Mac and the alternative is you either have to start from scratch and build a Mac app or you do the web which is like what Twitter's been doing on um and also Facebook and you know a lot of companies instead of building a Mac app their their Mac solution is to say here's a website oh I'm glad you brought disadvantages to that yeah I'm glad you brought up Facebook I need to to to thank our sponsors for a moment and then I want to ask you about Facebook in in a context here so you upgrade your smartphone your TV and your laptop but when's the last time you upgraded your home Wi-Fi the future of Wi-Fi is here it's time to welcome Wi-Fi 6 the Netgear Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 router gives you Ultra fast speeds and wider coverage throughout your home it's the biggest revolution in Wi-Fi ever you get four times the capacity compared to today's Wi-Fi which means you can connect more devices and stream simultaneously without impacting Wi-Fi speed and reliability the devices of today and tomorrow demand more your old Wi-Fi is timing out and you need the latest and high performance Wi-Fi that can keep up with you and your entire family if you stream your shows on services like Netflix or Hulu the newest line of high performance routers from Netgear will eliminate buffering and let you stream smoothly even in 4k it's like giving your streaming the VIP treatment if you game online lag will be a thing of the past turn your Wi-Fi up to 6 with a Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 router check it out today at Gent gear.com / wifi6 that's netgear.com swifi and the number six so you mentioned Facebook just a second ago and one of the things that they announced was the the concept of sign in with apple right and so so the way that I understand that is that for years we've had sign in with Google and you could sign into a website with a Google account and they would use ooth to go ahead and partner with Google or you could go ahead and site in sign in with Facebook and sign in with your Facebook account to sites and they would essenti use your Facebook account as your account for that site why is Apple doing this I think I know but I want you to tell me so the reason why applications do that is because there's a lot of cases where a company that's doing an app wants to have a relationship with you in some way or they're saving information for you or whatever it is um they want you to create a user account and having everyone create a user account is both a lot of work for developer because they have to manage it and it's also um something that when users start into it sometimes you're logging into something it's like when you go to Every web page and they want you to log in it's like I don't want to do this I don't care about this website so much I'm just going to like go somewhere else um and if you're an app developer the amount of people that come to your app and then walk away is a problem so you want to make it as easy as possible for them to set something up so that you can minimally serve them um and by using log into Facebook or Google they've been tapping into their social Network account so that uh when you go to an App instead of having to put in a username and all the stuff and you just sign with with Facebook and it takes you Facebook comes back and it makes it easier for the user however the downside of that is there's a lot of information that the user has it's not even clear how much information the user is giving up to to log in and we've seen a lot of abuse with with Facebook and their partners and how much data they're moving around and it starts to become a problem not only for users who are like what are you doing with this Facebook log but also for apps because when a when a developer has you login with Facebook not only are it's back to the problem of if I'm logging with Facebook it's like is that going to turn me off am I going to walk away so it's it's like another you know suboptimal solution that um creates privacy problems for the for the developer so Apple solution is instead of creating a social network of its own it's allowing users to log in using apple with their Apple ID but it's different from Facebook and that instead of handing this profile to the to the app developer it creates um sort of a token so that they can work with the user and the user is also get in control of what they're giving them so they can say here's my name or they they don't have to give you their name and they can say here's my email or they can say here's a here's a generic thing that will allow you to email me through apple and in the future I can just terminate that I can go into the to my settings and say I don't want to deal with this company anymore they're just me all the time and you can just delete it and then that company can't message you anymore and and do they get a real email or do they get a a sort of generated one just for them if the user says they don't want to share their email it gives them a like a number with it's something like Apple Ford um at Apple and so when um when they use that account to message the user and when they send that email Apple forwards it back to that user so that they get it but the user has the control to say no more of those and delete it they can also delete their whole account so it gives the user um understanding of what they're actually sharing what is gives them control of of their personal information they don't have a huge profile of data that maybe the developer is getting not clear you know and it's also better for the user because they or the developer because they're getting the opportunity to have a relationship with that customer and if they're doing the right things if they're providing a useful service then the customer want to hear from them and then they can request other information from them and uh build a relationship with that customer so it it really reduces friction for the developer it creates more um security for the user knowing that they're not just randomly connecting another whole company to all their information that they have online about them and so it's kind of a a win for both sides and as an alternative to social networks like Facebook um it's like I said it's better for the user and the developer and it reduces the amount of information that's being spread around and because Apple isn't posting all this information itself a lot of the things they've detailed about privacy is that Apple doesn't want the information so Apple's in a unique position to be able to offer this kind of security because they really don't want your data um Apple's making money on Hardware that's how they make their money and so they can uh offer security without worrying about so Apple can offer that type of security um because their business model isn't dependent upon it when we were talking about you know Smart TVs and all these other things they don't make any money those companies like barely making any money at all and that's basically the case with tablets and for most companies even with phones and with PCS and so they make their money by having all this adware that's collecting data about you TVs that you know report what you're watching and things like that and a lot of people don't like that and so I mean Apple's really playing that up as their their angle and that appeals to a lot of people because they don't want to have just like this huge cloud of information that you know might be construed the wrong way um there's there's a lot of problems that are that are not obvious from the beginning I see some of our readers will be like oh yeah I don't I don't care as long as it's free it's like then you don't know the whole picture of what's going on yeah there is a cost it's just somewhere else more problems there yeah yeah but but I can imagine that Facebook is probably not excited about this sign in with apple idea right they're they're they're probably well it's competing with their media I mean their ability to kind of control relationships with between developers and their customers but I mean I think we need to worry about Facebook they're making tons of money on ads and I I am tempted every day to leave Facebook I'm wondering what what's keeping me there it is there are some social aspects of it that are are very valuable but it's just like the the extreme cost of that kind of a system where just everything you say or everything you have online that's personal about you that you're trying to share with people is being shared with indiscriminately with everyone and I really don't like that yeah I I went through a process where I deleted all of my archives that were there like 11 years of stuff that they had that I'd posted and I I systematically went and deleted all of that and then I blocked the news feed so that I was only seeing the groups that I was in that I specifically intended to follow and then after doing that for a couple months I just went ahead and deleted the encount entirely yeah and that's for you know us old guys um young people aren't using Facebook it's just as are using a new set of apps yeah I mean it's just old old parent age people what do the kids use huh what what are this can't believe I said that last time I checked last time I checked I it's been a while hello fellow kids yeah what are we using um a lot of kids are using SnapChat which I didn't really get I've tried to use it but a lot of things that they're using and and of course um Facebook got into that and copied it to make stories for Instagram and they were very successful in knocking that off um one of the things that it seems that this younger generation behind us likes is instead of having sort of a permanent record like I have this I'm kind of a hoarder and I just can't get rid of things and I have you know I still have a a parac G5 somewhere in a box I got rid of I gotur on I got rid of the G5 and I got rid of the uh the the G4S that I had around finally but just the idea of of keeping holding on to things kind of forever and you know yeah when I was a kid we didn't have internet you know we had photos and you had boxes of photos somewhere and today there's such a wave of that you I don't think younger people are really as captivated with the idea of just having boxes of photos whether it's literal or sort of online somewhere so a lot of the things that they do is share experiences and so both Instagram stories and Snapchat are all about kind of checking in with your friends and seeing what they're doing in real time and things that in ways that are more authentic because originally the idea of sharing photos and kind of Instagram is sort of like look at me look what I'm doing doing but it's obviously kind of staged you know it's it's not authentic you know it's like here here I carefully orchestrated something where I'm not even having fun but here's this beautiful photo yeah I'm rich and I'm beautiful and you know I appli some filters to make myself look good there are people that set themselves up as influencers you know the same way that there there are actual people who are called influencers who have sponsored products people go out and buy the products and then set themselves up to look like it to try and launch themselves into becoming influencers right it's absurd that's that's kind of a a cycle of marketing that we've seen before where initially the psychology of marketing comes in and it sways an entire generation and then the generation behind them watches that occur and says wow this is really fake you know I don't I don't need Billboards everywhere telling you to drink Coca-Cola I don't even want to anymore and so advertisers have to keep you know changing their game because it becomes less effective to do the same things over and over again and we're kind of seeing that with this idea of you know look at me here's my beautiful photo of me and a fancy play with important people and it's I think there's a new it's sort of kind of driven by a desire to have authenticity so you're wanting to see not everybody you're not trying to show off for everybody but you're wanting to connect with your friends and show them you know hey this is what we did here's what we're doing right now do you want to come and hang out with us kind of thing um and I think that that's not what Facebook is designed to do yeah I think Facebook is trying to to you know obviously trying to accommodate that as well but Facebook is kind of turning into iTunes you know how it was like the cool thing for me it and then it just became more and more bloated and bigger and Huger and trying to do everything and you're like this isn't good at everything you know oh man so so first of all two questions cuz but I'm going have to do them in order so we have this apple single sign on thing how is Apple going to get developers on board with that what's what's what's the requirements here I think they make it mandatory for apps in the app store which is part of um like if your if your app signs in with social you need to add it and it's not hard to add and it's in the developer benefit because users are going to want to have it right if you're already requiring Facebook then you have to also require Sig in with apple yeah I mean I think you know they have a lot of Leverage to to make it popular among on their platform because they control the gates of the wal Garden you know yeah and that's also an issue people have been talking about is you know what should Apple have so much control and that is an interesting question I want to write more about it but one of the things that I've been thinking about recently is the alternative to one thing being in in control is something else so if you don't like apple being in control of apps which there's valid reason I know a lot of developers who are you know irritated that Apple stepped into their territory after you know letting them develop it you're talking about something like being sh locked that's sh loocking yeah that would be very frustrating however at the same time the alternative is um what if you don't have an app store or what if you don't have a company that's in charge of an app store then you have something more like Google where everything is just on fire and chaotic crap and you can't build upon it and you can't there's no business model all you can do is put ads in your app or track people there's no way to say here's an app that's useful and you can pay some significant amount for it and I can make money and you can have something that you really works for you that doesn't exist anywhere else and so we can take a power away from Apple but who who gets it do we give it to somebody else do we do like we did in the 80s and give it to Microsoft because Microsoft did a worse job um so I think people should think about the Alternatives you know it's really easy to come up with solutions to say hey shoot the rich but then who's who's next you know well you'd mentioned iTunes a minute ago and and how iTunes had grown from being doing one thing well rip mix burn to then synchronizing iPods and and then synchronizing iPhones and iPads and then apps and movies and pretty much had become this blow to do everything kind of app right right so what's happening with it so it's kind of surprising Apple didn't do this earlier but um they're taking a lot of the the features of iTunes that were kind of there because it was cross platform um so to have kind of a a similar experience across windows and the Mac they had to put all the iOS stuff into one place and now they're deciding that that's not important so the windows thing is kind of staying the same but on the Mac it's becoming a little B better organized so that uh some content that you work with differently so the way that you listen to music is similar conceptually to what you're doing when you listen to podcasts or to audiobooks or even when you're listening to the audio portion of TV or whatever but those things have we we interact with them differently so we kind of listen to music in the background and we stream music from Apple music or some people still like to buy downloads or rip their CDs those are all kind of conceptually similar in how we appreciate music TV is more of a sitting down watching something while it's happening it's intentional and so yeah and so the way that you choose what you're going to watch and all those things are different so that the browsing system is different and how you want to discover things is different as opposed to music and it's the same thing with books you you the way you appreciate an audio book is different and it's it's more similar to a book that you're going to read and podcasts are also have like their own way of interaction um and so by putting them into separate apps they can not only make the experience more consistent across the platforms so you have a podcast app that um makes sense across everything from an iPhone to Apple TV to your computer um it also um just simplifies a lot of things and then specifically on the Mac because you're pulling some types out they also say hey let's let's take the device stuff that works like a drive and put it into the finder where it belongs so when you plug your phone in or or an older iPod device it works like a drivewood and it puts out the same interface that was in iTunes before you know you put it in and it says here's your options for handling this it looks kind of identical from what I've seen I haven't worked with it extensively but so it's kind of more of just moving things and that's an example of what they're doing with uh Apple music is basically still iTunes that they give it a modern name to indicate that it's different because now it's based around Apple music subscription but you can still use it with the stuff you had before and you can still buy music and you have the option to either show or not show the iTunes Store in the sidebar so if you're using Apple music you might not care to do that unless you're trying to look up reviews and things that are unique to the the download store so we're not actually losing any functionality here right um I don't think there's anything that actually has gone away okay to think about that for a minute but I mean that's that's been one of the concerns people were worried people contacted me saying that they were worried that they weren't going to be able to continue to buy music people contacted me saying that they were worried about things like like apple taking over their music collection like uh you know they they'd heard years ago with iCloud Library iCloud music library where where they'd have a version locally and it would get synced and then their version would get lost kind of thing you know PE people are really concerned when you mess with their music well I mean part of that was because it was reported Wrong by a lot of companies that they heard something about I you know Apple was going to stop using the name iTunes yeah they stopped using the name ioto too they know it's photos and instead of calling it Tunes they're calling it song You Know music right um so it's not it's not really that crazy of a change but uh they immediately kind of jump to this conclusion to ask all these questions and a lot of it was because it was presented Wrong by the media instead of asking figing it out they tried to create this Sensational headline and this is not the first time they've done that too I mean I remember over the last couple years there was this thing of like Apple's going to kill downloads and it's like no they're not they've not indicated that at all um Apple would much rather you sell sell you download than Apple music they're making more money with downloads I think okay if you buy a lot of downloads so um yeah me a lot of it was just one of the biggest problems we have was just journalism is now based I mean it's not even journalism but it's online writing is just based around getting people upset it's not really to inform them to upset them because that drives ads better right let me put out a really really fearful fear inducing headline so that everyone reads my clicks through my article and it doesn't matter what's what's actually right or not yeah you know there a lot of articles that you know have some like scandalous headline they're just like what and then you read it and you're like first of all you didn't answer that question that you dramatically posed and second of all it doesn't really have anything to do and part of this is not even the writers sometimes you write an article and they put a headline on it that's like what yeah you're trying to boost Theo you're just making me look like a jerk yeah no I and I know people that that these things leave Lasting Impressions you know I know a person who will only buy MP3s from Amazon because they're afraid of buying music from Apple because they're afraid that it will get uh DRM never mind that DRM hasn't been a thing in what 10 years does make sense but yeah I know it doesn't make any sense except that we know that that once someone's taken on board this this position or read the article or taken the fearmongering it sticks with them well if you look at other companies I mean um Samsung's milk and Microsoft is on for a couple platforms where they just said like hey this isn't working out anymore so we're just going to dial it down and it's going to go away so it's kind of like what um who else did it there's been a number of companies that were just kind of like Hey we're changing our business model so like flicker with their photos yeah it's like hey we're gonna we're not doing this anymore this whole free thing didn't work out yeah and so when people get burned a couple times yeah they're probably thinking like Apple going to do that and uh yeah I have thought about like at what point what point will Apple keep supporting you know iPods from years ago but iPods are actually pretty simple I mean it doesn't require like a tremendous amount of effort to I mean they're a mass storage device with an iPod library on it it's not like it's a big deal yeah yeah you know and I've I've revived a number of those I put uh flash drives in them and I've got everything from the third generation forward still syncing with iTunes but outside of Apple I mean you know PCS were always kind of a thing that there are lot Microsoft has really hard to make windows work on everything kind of forever with some limitations but um a computer gets to a certain age and just can't do things anymore or can't do modern things anymore and with mobile devices it's even worse I mean like most of the world's phones are Android phones that can't get updates after 18 months yep or sooner that's why there that's why there's so many being sold you know they talk about unit sales and it's like of course you know everybody has to replace their phone they don't they don't address the turn in that figure right right and so that's why a lot of people you know they look at the numbers for example iPhones being sold in China you know Apple only has this like 177% market share or something but their share of the phones and use is actually leading you know it's like neck and neck with the biggest producer in China um so a lot of those statistics that are being presented are not really that's more examples of they're not as informative as they could be yeah let's come out with something that's shocking as opposed to Accurate or you know what what would you say is the biggest takeaway so far from WWDC the biggest takeaway yeah what has what has been the biggest change that you've seen what do you think is going to have the biggest impact down the road well as opposed to like a big change there's a lot of incremental things that are happening and every year there's incremental things and sometimes you look at and you're like why are they doing that and then the next year you're like oh that's why they did that and so a lot of things that like one of the things I was talking with a friend yesterday about was AR kit and they're like why is Apple doing all this work for air kit um you know put they're rapidly iterating on it like every year it has very sophisticated new features that are pretty incredible like the whole you know person occlusion where a person can walk through a 3D scene and the graphics are just like clipped behind them I mean magical um why is Apple doing this and it's kind of clear that Apple's not doing a just so you can have apps on your phone there's going to be glasses or or there's going to be windshields or you know there's so many uses for AR other things that have not been released yet yeah this is this is deeper than just the Ikea catalog right right and at the same time uh one of the interesting things that they that was mentioned uh was that developers who are using airkit in the most kind of the most obvious thing like you're talking about Ikea some of these partners that are building things where you can take a model and put it in your home and see it realistically at AR boost sales by 300% if somebody can place object in their house then they're like yes I'm I'm confidently going to buy this as opposed to I'm not sure my uh years ago my uncle ran an art gallery that sold art and and he would frame it and he uh he did this thing where he would loan it out to you you came and you wanted to buy something great they'd put it in your home you'd try it for a few weeks just to see that it fit fit with your lifestyle and stuff and then you'd buy it for that very reason yeah and so for for for big companies or you know for any company to be able to implement AR and get a benefit back from it that's what moves technology forward if you can find a way to make it useful and a way that pays for things there were a lot of things that Apple did in the '90s you know with QuickTime VR um it wasn't really clear what the use case was they tried to find some you know it's like here's here's a way to like go through a house that you might want to buy I remember the Volkswagen New Beetle they had a QuickTime VR movie for it and you could pan around the Beetle and see the dashboard and stuff right and it's kind of similar to arit in the sense that it was allowing you to explore 3D objects or world um arit is basically just taking that and and sinking up to the camera so you see this um 3D model in real space you a real environment um but they've worked they've kind of established a better way to sell it so a way that people are actually going to use it in a way that makes sense and people want to use it and of course they also have you know a billion devices out there as opposed to back in quick time VR it only worked on Max and kind of struggled to work on anywhere else and one of the kind of interesting things is Google figured out a way to use some of the ideas that Apple was working with with quick time VR where you could take you could make a node where you you look around 360 in a panorama click a button go ahead to this other space and and see another node from there and you have it's basically a movie that's not linear so instead of looking at a film one frame at a time along a film strip you're able to kind of look at frames in a movie and then jump to wherever else you want to go so it's kind of like h card for the for video um so the idea of panoramas and looking at models and looking at things over time Google translated that into street view so now you could be in a map you could look around you could click over there and look around from there and so they made a a valuable use case that people could do that with so now apple is doing that now they're taking their own technology and they're building it with you know they're they're now 10 years past where wherever whatever time it was that Google started with street maps so they're using a lot more advanced technology you know using lar and planes and stuff to basically create a street level version of flyover so now you're in the model and you're not just looking at photos you're looking at actual 3D you're looking at surfaces they have a 3D representation of the earth so when you're walking along you're seeing buildings that that have a 3D texture applied to them of the building pretty incredible it really is and it's it's new imagery so so I'm excited I'm excited about Maps changing and they it was pretty aggressive that they're gonna finally get the modern Maps across the entire United States this year that's cool because it seems like it's kind of been moving slow but you know this is a lot of work to model the entire United States Building at a time Maps is a big undertaking and it's been a big undertaking for anyone who's tried to do it and uh you know it's and again Apple has probably another reason for the future for map well whatever they're doing with vehicles that's going to be really kind of key with when you're to have your own map so apple is developing a lot ofch techologies that right now aren't quite so obvious what the reason why they're doing it but in the future it's going to be more obvious all right well I I don't want to keep you because I know you've got things to get to where can people find you on the internet well I'm writing for Apple Insider I have my articles up on roughly drafted and my Twitter is Daniel Aaron e r an Danel Daniel Aaron great I'm at V marks on Twitter and we will be back next week with more when's the last time you upgraded your home with Wi-Fi turn your Wi-Fi up a notch with netgear's new line of Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 routers whether you're gaming online or watching Netflix in 4k it's like giving your streaming the VIP treatment you'll enjoy buffer-free streaming and zero lag no matter how many devices are connected to your network upgrade your W router at netgear.com wifi6 make your Wi-Fi feel young againyou're listening to the Apple Insider podcast all right welcome back to this episode of the Apple Insider podcast I'm Victor and joining me is Daniel eron diler from WWDC good morning from San Jose how is San Jose uh it's quite nice it got pretty hot so no need to wear a jacket most of the time except inside the conference Hall some of them are refrigerated to the point of needing to put on the on the jacket wow well at least they gave out jackets right yeah they they had a like a bomber jacket and there's several different kinds each has a different color it's a similar print but it's a different primary color so makes everybody kind of brightly a bright bunch of people yeah but that's not what listeners are here for right that's that's not one of our audience is talking about is the jacket because what they really want to know about is is what the heck is going on there right we we saw this very very big cheese grater Mac Pro we saw the Monitor and the monitor stand and a whole bunch of other things so let's start talking about that tell me about the Mac Pro well Apple took I mean wwc is obviously for developers it's where this whole Conference of they're talking about what's new and their new operating systems and the reason why the pro was announced as Hardware it's not common that there's Hardware released um but this is a product that Apple hasn't uh updated again since since 2014 I think and there were several years where it was the the can size which I think everybody realizes was sort of a mistake I mean they they created this product that was almost like a consumer product that was you know looked cute and everything but it wasn't really expandable in the way that Pro people needed wanted and so here they're kind of coming back to the design similar to the aluminum Max that came out in what 2005 or 2003 uh right the the old Power G5 yeah yeah so it's a more modular design I mean it's more of a typical kind of PC type design where you have a tremendous number of slots huge amounts of uh expansion potential using PCI you also have Thunderbolt which is basic PCI in the form of a cable um so it allows you to do very powerful things uh that's that's Apple's expansion uh interconnect basically for the MacBook Pros you can plug in multiple displays and all kinds of other things and raid devices and everything so you have both of those things on the Mac Pro uh you have you know the Bing architecture and the processors that it's using are are they're kind of overkill for most people they're they're very high-end and so it's also an expensive machine uh but so they showed that off along with a monitor which Apple doesn't really sell monitors anymore but this is doing things that you can't do with most other devices out there I mean they kind of highlighted that there was no other device that hit all the check boxs that they wanted to deliver and particularly for people who are doing 4K video so it's or um yes working with any kind of high-end video and audio and um working with tons of tracks and so the really positioning the Mac platform is being able to handle really complex tasks and workflows for Professionals for whom the price is and the primary consideration is it's a capability so this is not for consumers you know when consumers look at and they're like wow $5,000 for a Macintosh to begin with uh and then you know goes up dramatically this is not for people you know doing Excel spreadsheets this is for people who are making money with their machine yeah this is not imov right this this is something other than that right I mean Apple has their own Pro apps and they have a developer community of who make Pro apps and there's other uh developers that in other ways service people who are working in pro professional environments like that so it is relevant to developers and that's why it was presented here because they're showing that this is things you can do with our platform and now with the future we're going to be building out this this is not something that's going to sell in the you know tens of millions like iOS devices sell um so it's a very different Market but it is important for developers who work with those kinds of clients or who themselves have really crushing workflows that they need to have huge hardware for you know recompiling software and uh in huge huge environments where you're doing really complex things it's the Mac Pro is relevant to them in both directions let me ask there's there's a couple of things that stuck out to me as being interesting and unique there um one of them was after burner and the other was what looked to me to be extensions or modifications on the PCI slot can you talk to a little bit about afterburner afterburner is an optional uh card that is a fpga basically a it's basically a chip that can be programmed to do a variety of things after the fact and so there it's it's a A specialized type of processor that lets you um reprogram how it works and so Apple's initially using it to radically um speed up how fast it can do Graphics operations um I don't know what else I haven't really looked at that really closely I'm I think there's a lot of machine learning kind of compute tasks that can also handle but um what it really reminded me of was if you remember the old next Cube they had the next Dimension board that just it was I think it was maybe more expensive than the motherboard but you put it in and it just like raised the the hardware capacity of the machine just this incredible extent using specialized chips that were had you know was kind of brand new technology it's kind of along the those lines of you can put in uh you can put in sort of conventional gpus or this is a a special card that Apple's offering to really dramatically improve the performance of pro workflows now it's interesting that you brought up next because one of the other things WWDC is for is is all of the software changes for developers and it sort of occurred to me that this is is a seismic shift as a year goes as WWDC goes because it feels in a way like all of the things that were carried over from next are going away you know there's no more interface Builder project Builder that that uh the whole app kit UI kit shift that's taking place with swift UI do you sort of understand what I'm asking or what I'm saying here well um yeah conceptually it's kind of the same thing though because a lot of what next was trying to achieve and remember next was the company that Steve JS founded after he left Apple in the mid 80s so the late 80s um he called it next because it was basically the next thing after what Apple was doing in the 80s with the Macintosh and so at the beginning of the 90s they were roll at this computer of the future with an operating system of the future and a number of things that it attempted to do was to make programming easier to make graphics just tremendously more advanced where you're compositing on the screen instead of just working with B maps and a lot of the things that that it conceptually started are things that Apple later um turned into Mac OS 10 and they changed a lot of that too they they refreshed it because it was like almost 10 years later and here we are 20 years after that you know Mac OS 10 is almost 20 years old and so they're taking a lot of the ideas and bringing them into the future so the interface Builder what it was was a tool for basically generating code from a graphical uh tool so you lay out interfaces quickly and see how they worked um and at the time it was kind of revolutionary uh now it's it's not hasn't been for a while U and some of the tools that Apple's building uh have superseded what it can do but particularly what they're what they introduced this year was Swift UI which is a uh it's built upon the work that they've been doing with swift their new programming language that you know new it's five years old I think now but they're constantly working on uh developing a a language that can handle kind of the needs of the future and also dramatically uh reduce the amount of code you need to do a lot of things because the less code you have the less opportunity you have for mistakes and less things you have to correct so the the biggest demonstration they showed was for doing lists and and on on Mac OS 10 using um conventional development tools uh with Objective C if you look at Objective C code it's kind of difficult to read um it you have to very uh specifically put things in a in a very verbose kind of description of how you want your how you you want to build your interface with swift UI what it's doing is it's using the power of the switch language to um pair down a lot of the work that you're doing so that not only does it require less code to do kind of simple things like laying out a a listing of things on your on an iPhone screen that you can interact with but then it adds a lot of other functionality for free so once you do this you lay it out in this very descriptive way then the operating system and the the framework underneath it is handling a lot of the work that they're doing behind the scenes already for things like dark mode um which is a lot more complicated than just turning black to white or inverting colors there's a lot of thought that goes into the user interface in terms of like layers of how do you make how how do you let the user feel grounded and understand what's happening in animations and and all these kind of things so there's a lot of complexity for if Apple just said here's what we want it to look like and developers you do it then everyone's implementation would look a little bit different and it wouldn't be consistent and it would be a tremendous amount of work for every developer to be doing so a lot of what Apple does in terms of their platform is do all that work that's common amongst applications so that developers can focus on what they're trying to do so they get things like dark mode sort of for free when they're building with swift UI and it also works it does um things related to supporting other languages there's a lot of developers who don't you know maybe they don't know Arabic and Hebrew and they don't understand what's involved with right to left languages and so this is something that handles that kind of stuff for them um so it's kind of a progression of of what the Macintosh first delivered and then what next kind of pushed ahead and so now they're you know they're pushing the same kind of Concepts ahead in modern ways using modern tools and the modern um languages so conceptually it's kind of the same but yes it is replacing in the same way that you know QuickTime was replaced by AV kit and or AV Tools uh and everything that we kind of knew of as sort of a brand name eventually kind of goes away and is replaced by a modern version of what that was one of the things that I was thinking when I saw Swift UI was the idea that the the device becomes just a de Target and and so I was thinking about the possibility of being able to use Swift UI to write for the web for example sort of as a as a sort of modern web objects kind of idea I I don't see that there's a plan to do that um so part of the web is very useful in some ways and it's you know it's kind of obvious that how ways is useful but it's Al not useful in a number of ways and one of the things that we've kind of learned is that when you write for the web you're write you're not writing for you're writing for every browser anyone can ever think of and as that changes and as um you know originally was Microsoft they kind of controlled the web browser and they introduced whatever they wanted to introduce and then when there was more fractionization between different browsers it became more work to figure out how to do it and it was this effort to have all these standard bodies that were doing this thing together and then you have somebody else saying like hey we you know we like working with a standard body but we have a much better way to do this other thing and so they you know that's a lot of what Google is doing now with their browser is kind of like establishing themselves as the new Microsoft where they're doing a lot of things that just don't work on other browsers because Google has done something that to support you know really complex web applications and so the a lot of the open promise of the web is is just not possible to deliver someone's going to be in control of it and if you look at apps a lot of what apple is doing with apps is native it's native code that's running optimized for a specific device so on the Mac it was like Mac app is software that's designed for Macintosh and it takes very optimized use of the hardware and everything on it and it looks really nice and that's the whole thing you know works like a Mac or has this Mac look and feel software 4 um when iOS came out they developed an entirely new kind of Paradigm of software of how it interacts and everything that made sense on a small device and a touch interface and that they did the same thing you know on a little bit bigger scale with the iPad and added other features that only make sense on a device that's that big and with the premise of the web is you could build something that looks great on all of them but it doesn't we already know that web apps don't look there's a lot of disadvantages to using the web for going across platform because it's not optimized for anything and so what Apple really established they they kind of turn back this thought that everything was going to the web and Google for example is very web company that that's how they reach everybody is that they put it on a web interface and there are some advantages to doing things like that but for consumers in particular and also for pro pro users there's tremendous advantages when you have something designed so that your hardware and your software designed together to work together optimally and it's not just trying to have some sort of open thing that it's doing in a web browser so they're they're very useful things we do on the web but for most users if they have a choice between a web app and a native app they're going to choose the app because it works better and there's a lot of things you can do in an app that just don't work really well on a on a browser and a lot of browser efforts are trying to make something that's basically so complicated that or so sophisticated and complex that it's becoming like an app a native app that runs on a program so a lot of the work that Apple's doing with its platforms are really competing with the web so when Apple makes a tool it's not making a tool to also put them on the web because the features the the things that they would have to do to make at work would also destroy the value of what they actually did to make it exist all right thank thanks for answering that I know I was thinking out there a little ahead but uh and a little out there but it seemed like a thought because one of the things that we've talked about on this show in the past weeks have been things like project marzipan which I think is now Catalyst and and trying to figure out you know our iPad apps coming to the Mac what happens to what we traditionally think of as a Mac app and how does this puzzle piece fit together how does that work so the the framework for developing Mac apps which has been in place since Mac OS 10 is called appkit or yeah it's called out kit and when they developed when they basically turned when they came out with the iPhone the iPhone was basically Mac OS 10 in the shape of a mobile device but instead of calling it Macos 10 they gave it another another um name and they optimized a lot of the Frameworks so when you're building applications for an iPhone there's certain things that just don't make sense from the Mac so they got rid of those there are things that make sense on a phone that didn't make sense on the Mac so they original implementations and also because they're doing all this work they're they're rewriting this from scratch they can fix a lot of things that um could be done better than they were on the Mac And so there's a little bit of technology that washes back and forth where they do something on the iPhone and they bring it to the Mac for example the animation kit that does all the nice animations for you when Windows move around and things that was brought back to the mac and then there's also things that were created on the Mac that have come to the iPhone now we're now in in you know 10 years into iOS and there's been a lot of talk of how they going to converge the two and make them the same thing and there's a number of reasons kind of like what we're talking about the web that you don't want to do that there's there should be separate platforms I would argue there even becoming more separate right now with the introduction of iPad OS right I mean they kind of hinted that before when they came out with you know tvos and watch OS and it's like why do they have these different names they're really just iOS but they have optimizations and the point of giving it a different name is that there's a different interaction model that's significant enough to where it kind of needs its own name so that even though there's a lot of similarities there's a lot of things that are exactly the same um the way that you interact with a TV using a remote control is is very different than if you have a piece of glass that you're touching like an iPhone or an iPad and with the iPad and iPhone there's enough difference there because you have such a big difference in screen real state that you can do a lot of things with drag and drop and kind of working with multiple documents next to each other that do it's a little too cramped on a phone to make sense and so like you're saying they're they're making these different buckets so you can talk about them individually in a way that makes sense um now for iPhone and iPad there have been similar enough that they were given the same name until this year um and when you develop when you're building an app it's kind of another checkbox that you Mark and you say I want this app to also work on the iPad and then you can customize things to your iPad app that make it um make sense on an iPad what list is is another checkbox that says I want this app that works great on iPad to work on a Mac it's not emulation it's not hosting it in like a a VM or something it's not a simulator it's a real thing right so what what it does it takes your app your um on the on iOS apps are built with uiit which is just the the analog of um appkit right and they're compiled for an arm processor right so what it does is it um builds that app for the mac and on the Mac side they've built the Frameworks behind it to support that and additionally when you when you create when you take an iPad app and you make it work on the Mac which Apple first demonstrated on some of their own apps last year um and now they're doing with things like podcasts when you bring them that Mac app to the Mac it's a Mac app it was built with a little bit different tools but it doesn't make it look different it doesn't make it behave different say it's not supposed to be different and users aren't even supposed to notice it's just an app that works on the system um it was just built with a little bit different tools and the way that developers create those apps is you know procedurally a little bit different but it creates native apps and so the point is there are a million iPad apps that are customized for iPads and a lot of those would make sense to bring to the Mac however because if you have a team for example Twitter that has an iPhone app and has an iPad app for them to build an a Mac app before this year they would have to start over an appkit and do things radically different so it's a totally different program it's almost I mean it's not quite as much difference as you know building an out for Windows well it's actually a really good example signicant different it's it's a good example I was reading that someone looked at at Twitter and they they' estimated that Twitter for Mac when it was still Twitter for Mac in its last release had something like 990,000 lines of code and that Twitter for iOS has something like 1.56 million that that they've diverged that much from when they had a Mac app and an IOS app that were more similar and yeah anytime you have two different code bases they they're going to progress separately and there's it's a totally different project yeah so what Catalyst does is allows you to take the work all these companies have already put invested tremendous amounts of effort into iOS it allows them to take their work and make it into a Mac app that works like a Mac app and they can additionally add on to it Mac features that are unique to the Mac the same way that I iPad apps have features that don't work on an iPhone because they different you know different in scale and different in features and what they can do and so with Catalyst it allows teams that have like a an iOS code base to bring that to the Mac so there's millions of there's at least a million iPad apps that are already customized for iPad that a lot of those make sense on the Mac and the alternative is you either have to start from scratch and build a Mac app or you do the web which is like what Twitter's been doing on um and also Facebook and you know a lot of companies instead of building a Mac app their their Mac solution is to say here's a website oh I'm glad you brought disadvantages to that yeah I'm glad you brought up Facebook I need to to to thank our sponsors for a moment and then I want to ask you about Facebook in in a context here so you upgrade your smartphone your TV and your laptop but when's the last time you upgraded your home Wi-Fi the future of Wi-Fi is here it's time to welcome Wi-Fi 6 the Netgear Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 router gives you Ultra fast speeds and wider coverage throughout your home it's the biggest revolution in Wi-Fi ever you get four times the capacity compared to today's Wi-Fi which means you can connect more devices and stream simultaneously without impacting Wi-Fi speed and reliability the devices of today and tomorrow demand more your old Wi-Fi is timing out and you need the latest and high performance Wi-Fi that can keep up with you and your entire family if you stream your shows on services like Netflix or Hulu the newest line of high performance routers from Netgear will eliminate buffering and let you stream smoothly even in 4k it's like giving your streaming the VIP treatment if you game online lag will be a thing of the past turn your Wi-Fi up to 6 with a Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 router check it out today at Gent gear.com / wifi6 that's netgear.com swifi and the number six so you mentioned Facebook just a second ago and one of the things that they announced was the the concept of sign in with apple right and so so the way that I understand that is that for years we've had sign in with Google and you could sign into a website with a Google account and they would use ooth to go ahead and partner with Google or you could go ahead and site in sign in with Facebook and sign in with your Facebook account to sites and they would essenti use your Facebook account as your account for that site why is Apple doing this I think I know but I want you to tell me so the reason why applications do that is because there's a lot of cases where a company that's doing an app wants to have a relationship with you in some way or they're saving information for you or whatever it is um they want you to create a user account and having everyone create a user account is both a lot of work for developer because they have to manage it and it's also um something that when users start into it sometimes you're logging into something it's like when you go to Every web page and they want you to log in it's like I don't want to do this I don't care about this website so much I'm just going to like go somewhere else um and if you're an app developer the amount of people that come to your app and then walk away is a problem so you want to make it as easy as possible for them to set something up so that you can minimally serve them um and by using log into Facebook or Google they've been tapping into their social Network account so that uh when you go to an App instead of having to put in a username and all the stuff and you just sign with with Facebook and it takes you Facebook comes back and it makes it easier for the user however the downside of that is there's a lot of information that the user has it's not even clear how much information the user is giving up to to log in and we've seen a lot of abuse with with Facebook and their partners and how much data they're moving around and it starts to become a problem not only for users who are like what are you doing with this Facebook log but also for apps because when a when a developer has you login with Facebook not only are it's back to the problem of if I'm logging with Facebook it's like is that going to turn me off am I going to walk away so it's it's like another you know suboptimal solution that um creates privacy problems for the for the developer so Apple solution is instead of creating a social network of its own it's allowing users to log in using apple with their Apple ID but it's different from Facebook and that instead of handing this profile to the to the app developer it creates um sort of a token so that they can work with the user and the user is also get in control of what they're giving them so they can say here's my name or they they don't have to give you their name and they can say here's my email or they can say here's a here's a generic thing that will allow you to email me through apple and in the future I can just terminate that I can go into the to my settings and say I don't want to deal with this company anymore they're just me all the time and you can just delete it and then that company can't message you anymore and and do they get a real email or do they get a a sort of generated one just for them if the user says they don't want to share their email it gives them a like a number with it's something like Apple Ford um at Apple and so when um when they use that account to message the user and when they send that email Apple forwards it back to that user so that they get it but the user has the control to say no more of those and delete it they can also delete their whole account so it gives the user um understanding of what they're actually sharing what is gives them control of of their personal information they don't have a huge profile of data that maybe the developer is getting not clear you know and it's also better for the user because they or the developer because they're getting the opportunity to have a relationship with that customer and if they're doing the right things if they're providing a useful service then the customer want to hear from them and then they can request other information from them and uh build a relationship with that customer so it it really reduces friction for the developer it creates more um security for the user knowing that they're not just randomly connecting another whole company to all their information that they have online about them and so it's kind of a a win for both sides and as an alternative to social networks like Facebook um it's like I said it's better for the user and the developer and it reduces the amount of information that's being spread around and because Apple isn't posting all this information itself a lot of the things they've detailed about privacy is that Apple doesn't want the information so Apple's in a unique position to be able to offer this kind of security because they really don't want your data um Apple's making money on Hardware that's how they make their money and so they can uh offer security without worrying about so Apple can offer that type of security um because their business model isn't dependent upon it when we were talking about you know Smart TVs and all these other things they don't make any money those companies like barely making any money at all and that's basically the case with tablets and for most companies even with phones and with PCS and so they make their money by having all this adware that's collecting data about you TVs that you know report what you're watching and things like that and a lot of people don't like that and so I mean Apple's really playing that up as their their angle and that appeals to a lot of people because they don't want to have just like this huge cloud of information that you know might be construed the wrong way um there's there's a lot of problems that are that are not obvious from the beginning I see some of our readers will be like oh yeah I don't I don't care as long as it's free it's like then you don't know the whole picture of what's going on yeah there is a cost it's just somewhere else more problems there yeah yeah but but I can imagine that Facebook is probably not excited about this sign in with apple idea right they're they're they're probably well it's competing with their media I mean their ability to kind of control relationships with between developers and their customers but I mean I think we need to worry about Facebook they're making tons of money on ads and I I am tempted every day to leave Facebook I'm wondering what what's keeping me there it is there are some social aspects of it that are are very valuable but it's just like the the extreme cost of that kind of a system where just everything you say or everything you have online that's personal about you that you're trying to share with people is being shared with indiscriminately with everyone and I really don't like that yeah I I went through a process where I deleted all of my archives that were there like 11 years of stuff that they had that I'd posted and I I systematically went and deleted all of that and then I blocked the news feed so that I was only seeing the groups that I was in that I specifically intended to follow and then after doing that for a couple months I just went ahead and deleted the encount entirely yeah and that's for you know us old guys um young people aren't using Facebook it's just as are using a new set of apps yeah I mean it's just old old parent age people what do the kids use huh what what are this can't believe I said that last time I checked last time I checked I it's been a while hello fellow kids yeah what are we using um a lot of kids are using SnapChat which I didn't really get I've tried to use it but a lot of things that they're using and and of course um Facebook got into that and copied it to make stories for Instagram and they were very successful in knocking that off um one of the things that it seems that this younger generation behind us likes is instead of having sort of a permanent record like I have this I'm kind of a hoarder and I just can't get rid of things and I have you know I still have a a parac G5 somewhere in a box I got rid of I gotur on I got rid of the G5 and I got rid of the uh the the G4S that I had around finally but just the idea of of keeping holding on to things kind of forever and you know yeah when I was a kid we didn't have internet you know we had photos and you had boxes of photos somewhere and today there's such a wave of that you I don't think younger people are really as captivated with the idea of just having boxes of photos whether it's literal or sort of online somewhere so a lot of the things that they do is share experiences and so both Instagram stories and Snapchat are all about kind of checking in with your friends and seeing what they're doing in real time and things that in ways that are more authentic because originally the idea of sharing photos and kind of Instagram is sort of like look at me look what I'm doing doing but it's obviously kind of staged you know it's it's not authentic you know it's like here here I carefully orchestrated something where I'm not even having fun but here's this beautiful photo yeah I'm rich and I'm beautiful and you know I appli some filters to make myself look good there are people that set themselves up as influencers you know the same way that there there are actual people who are called influencers who have sponsored products people go out and buy the products and then set themselves up to look like it to try and launch themselves into becoming influencers right it's absurd that's that's kind of a a cycle of marketing that we've seen before where initially the psychology of marketing comes in and it sways an entire generation and then the generation behind them watches that occur and says wow this is really fake you know I don't I don't need Billboards everywhere telling you to drink Coca-Cola I don't even want to anymore and so advertisers have to keep you know changing their game because it becomes less effective to do the same things over and over again and we're kind of seeing that with this idea of you know look at me here's my beautiful photo of me and a fancy play with important people and it's I think there's a new it's sort of kind of driven by a desire to have authenticity so you're wanting to see not everybody you're not trying to show off for everybody but you're wanting to connect with your friends and show them you know hey this is what we did here's what we're doing right now do you want to come and hang out with us kind of thing um and I think that that's not what Facebook is designed to do yeah I think Facebook is trying to to you know obviously trying to accommodate that as well but Facebook is kind of turning into iTunes you know how it was like the cool thing for me it and then it just became more and more bloated and bigger and Huger and trying to do everything and you're like this isn't good at everything you know oh man so so first of all two questions cuz but I'm going have to do them in order so we have this apple single sign on thing how is Apple going to get developers on board with that what's what's what's the requirements here I think they make it mandatory for apps in the app store which is part of um like if your if your app signs in with social you need to add it and it's not hard to add and it's in the developer benefit because users are going to want to have it right if you're already requiring Facebook then you have to also require Sig in with apple yeah I mean I think you know they have a lot of Leverage to to make it popular among on their platform because they control the gates of the wal Garden you know yeah and that's also an issue people have been talking about is you know what should Apple have so much control and that is an interesting question I want to write more about it but one of the things that I've been thinking about recently is the alternative to one thing being in in control is something else so if you don't like apple being in control of apps which there's valid reason I know a lot of developers who are you know irritated that Apple stepped into their territory after you know letting them develop it you're talking about something like being sh locked that's sh loocking yeah that would be very frustrating however at the same time the alternative is um what if you don't have an app store or what if you don't have a company that's in charge of an app store then you have something more like Google where everything is just on fire and chaotic crap and you can't build upon it and you can't there's no business model all you can do is put ads in your app or track people there's no way to say here's an app that's useful and you can pay some significant amount for it and I can make money and you can have something that you really works for you that doesn't exist anywhere else and so we can take a power away from Apple but who who gets it do we give it to somebody else do we do like we did in the 80s and give it to Microsoft because Microsoft did a worse job um so I think people should think about the Alternatives you know it's really easy to come up with solutions to say hey shoot the rich but then who's who's next you know well you'd mentioned iTunes a minute ago and and how iTunes had grown from being doing one thing well rip mix burn to then synchronizing iPods and and then synchronizing iPhones and iPads and then apps and movies and pretty much had become this blow to do everything kind of app right right so what's happening with it so it's kind of surprising Apple didn't do this earlier but um they're taking a lot of the the features of iTunes that were kind of there because it was cross platform um so to have kind of a a similar experience across windows and the Mac they had to put all the iOS stuff into one place and now they're deciding that that's not important so the windows thing is kind of staying the same but on the Mac it's becoming a little B better organized so that uh some content that you work with differently so the way that you listen to music is similar conceptually to what you're doing when you listen to podcasts or to audiobooks or even when you're listening to the audio portion of TV or whatever but those things have we we interact with them differently so we kind of listen to music in the background and we stream music from Apple music or some people still like to buy downloads or rip their CDs those are all kind of conceptually similar in how we appreciate music TV is more of a sitting down watching something while it's happening it's intentional and so yeah and so the way that you choose what you're going to watch and all those things are different so that the browsing system is different and how you want to discover things is different as opposed to music and it's the same thing with books you you the way you appreciate an audio book is different and it's it's more similar to a book that you're going to read and podcasts are also have like their own way of interaction um and so by putting them into separate apps they can not only make the experience more consistent across the platforms so you have a podcast app that um makes sense across everything from an iPhone to Apple TV to your computer um it also um just simplifies a lot of things and then specifically on the Mac because you're pulling some types out they also say hey let's let's take the device stuff that works like a drive and put it into the finder where it belongs so when you plug your phone in or or an older iPod device it works like a drivewood and it puts out the same interface that was in iTunes before you know you put it in and it says here's your options for handling this it looks kind of identical from what I've seen I haven't worked with it extensively but so it's kind of more of just moving things and that's an example of what they're doing with uh Apple music is basically still iTunes that they give it a modern name to indicate that it's different because now it's based around Apple music subscription but you can still use it with the stuff you had before and you can still buy music and you have the option to either show or not show the iTunes Store in the sidebar so if you're using Apple music you might not care to do that unless you're trying to look up reviews and things that are unique to the the download store so we're not actually losing any functionality here right um I don't think there's anything that actually has gone away okay to think about that for a minute but I mean that's that's been one of the concerns people were worried people contacted me saying that they were worried that they weren't going to be able to continue to buy music people contacted me saying that they were worried about things like like apple taking over their music collection like uh you know they they'd heard years ago with iCloud Library iCloud music library where where they'd have a version locally and it would get synced and then their version would get lost kind of thing you know PE people are really concerned when you mess with their music well I mean part of that was because it was reported Wrong by a lot of companies that they heard something about I you know Apple was going to stop using the name iTunes yeah they stopped using the name ioto too they know it's photos and instead of calling it Tunes they're calling it song You Know music right um so it's not it's not really that crazy of a change but uh they immediately kind of jump to this conclusion to ask all these questions and a lot of it was because it was presented Wrong by the media instead of asking figing it out they tried to create this Sensational headline and this is not the first time they've done that too I mean I remember over the last couple years there was this thing of like Apple's going to kill downloads and it's like no they're not they've not indicated that at all um Apple would much rather you sell sell you download than Apple music they're making more money with downloads I think okay if you buy a lot of downloads so um yeah me a lot of it was just one of the biggest problems we have was just journalism is now based I mean it's not even journalism but it's online writing is just based around getting people upset it's not really to inform them to upset them because that drives ads better right let me put out a really really fearful fear inducing headline so that everyone reads my clicks through my article and it doesn't matter what's what's actually right or not yeah you know there a lot of articles that you know have some like scandalous headline they're just like what and then you read it and you're like first of all you didn't answer that question that you dramatically posed and second of all it doesn't really have anything to do and part of this is not even the writers sometimes you write an article and they put a headline on it that's like what yeah you're trying to boost Theo you're just making me look like a jerk yeah no I and I know people that that these things leave Lasting Impressions you know I know a person who will only buy MP3s from Amazon because they're afraid of buying music from Apple because they're afraid that it will get uh DRM never mind that DRM hasn't been a thing in what 10 years does make sense but yeah I know it doesn't make any sense except that we know that that once someone's taken on board this this position or read the article or taken the fearmongering it sticks with them well if you look at other companies I mean um Samsung's milk and Microsoft is on for a couple platforms where they just said like hey this isn't working out anymore so we're just going to dial it down and it's going to go away so it's kind of like what um who else did it there's been a number of companies that were just kind of like Hey we're changing our business model so like flicker with their photos yeah it's like hey we're gonna we're not doing this anymore this whole free thing didn't work out yeah and so when people get burned a couple times yeah they're probably thinking like Apple going to do that and uh yeah I have thought about like at what point what point will Apple keep supporting you know iPods from years ago but iPods are actually pretty simple I mean it doesn't require like a tremendous amount of effort to I mean they're a mass storage device with an iPod library on it it's not like it's a big deal yeah yeah you know and I've I've revived a number of those I put uh flash drives in them and I've got everything from the third generation forward still syncing with iTunes but outside of Apple I mean you know PCS were always kind of a thing that there are lot Microsoft has really hard to make windows work on everything kind of forever with some limitations but um a computer gets to a certain age and just can't do things anymore or can't do modern things anymore and with mobile devices it's even worse I mean like most of the world's phones are Android phones that can't get updates after 18 months yep or sooner that's why there that's why there's so many being sold you know they talk about unit sales and it's like of course you know everybody has to replace their phone they don't they don't address the turn in that figure right right and so that's why a lot of people you know they look at the numbers for example iPhones being sold in China you know Apple only has this like 177% market share or something but their share of the phones and use is actually leading you know it's like neck and neck with the biggest producer in China um so a lot of those statistics that are being presented are not really that's more examples of they're not as informative as they could be yeah let's come out with something that's shocking as opposed to Accurate or you know what what would you say is the biggest takeaway so far from WWDC the biggest takeaway yeah what has what has been the biggest change that you've seen what do you think is going to have the biggest impact down the road well as opposed to like a big change there's a lot of incremental things that are happening and every year there's incremental things and sometimes you look at and you're like why are they doing that and then the next year you're like oh that's why they did that and so a lot of things that like one of the things I was talking with a friend yesterday about was AR kit and they're like why is Apple doing all this work for air kit um you know put they're rapidly iterating on it like every year it has very sophisticated new features that are pretty incredible like the whole you know person occlusion where a person can walk through a 3D scene and the graphics are just like clipped behind them I mean magical um why is Apple doing this and it's kind of clear that Apple's not doing a just so you can have apps on your phone there's going to be glasses or or there's going to be windshields or you know there's so many uses for AR other things that have not been released yet yeah this is this is deeper than just the Ikea catalog right right and at the same time uh one of the interesting things that they that was mentioned uh was that developers who are using airkit in the most kind of the most obvious thing like you're talking about Ikea some of these partners that are building things where you can take a model and put it in your home and see it realistically at AR boost sales by 300% if somebody can place object in their house then they're like yes I'm I'm confidently going to buy this as opposed to I'm not sure my uh years ago my uncle ran an art gallery that sold art and and he would frame it and he uh he did this thing where he would loan it out to you you came and you wanted to buy something great they'd put it in your home you'd try it for a few weeks just to see that it fit fit with your lifestyle and stuff and then you'd buy it for that very reason yeah and so for for for big companies or you know for any company to be able to implement AR and get a benefit back from it that's what moves technology forward if you can find a way to make it useful and a way that pays for things there were a lot of things that Apple did in the '90s you know with QuickTime VR um it wasn't really clear what the use case was they tried to find some you know it's like here's here's a way to like go through a house that you might want to buy I remember the Volkswagen New Beetle they had a QuickTime VR movie for it and you could pan around the Beetle and see the dashboard and stuff right and it's kind of similar to arit in the sense that it was allowing you to explore 3D objects or world um arit is basically just taking that and and sinking up to the camera so you see this um 3D model in real space you a real environment um but they've worked they've kind of established a better way to sell it so a way that people are actually going to use it in a way that makes sense and people want to use it and of course they also have you know a billion devices out there as opposed to back in quick time VR it only worked on Max and kind of struggled to work on anywhere else and one of the kind of interesting things is Google figured out a way to use some of the ideas that Apple was working with with quick time VR where you could take you could make a node where you you look around 360 in a panorama click a button go ahead to this other space and and see another node from there and you have it's basically a movie that's not linear so instead of looking at a film one frame at a time along a film strip you're able to kind of look at frames in a movie and then jump to wherever else you want to go so it's kind of like h card for the for video um so the idea of panoramas and looking at models and looking at things over time Google translated that into street view so now you could be in a map you could look around you could click over there and look around from there and so they made a a valuable use case that people could do that with so now apple is doing that now they're taking their own technology and they're building it with you know they're they're now 10 years past where wherever whatever time it was that Google started with street maps so they're using a lot more advanced technology you know using lar and planes and stuff to basically create a street level version of flyover so now you're in the model and you're not just looking at photos you're looking at actual 3D you're looking at surfaces they have a 3D representation of the earth so when you're walking along you're seeing buildings that that have a 3D texture applied to them of the building pretty incredible it really is and it's it's new imagery so so I'm excited I'm excited about Maps changing and they it was pretty aggressive that they're gonna finally get the modern Maps across the entire United States this year that's cool because it seems like it's kind of been moving slow but you know this is a lot of work to model the entire United States Building at a time Maps is a big undertaking and it's been a big undertaking for anyone who's tried to do it and uh you know it's and again Apple has probably another reason for the future for map well whatever they're doing with vehicles that's going to be really kind of key with when you're to have your own map so apple is developing a lot ofch techologies that right now aren't quite so obvious what the reason why they're doing it but in the future it's going to be more obvious all right well I I don't want to keep you because I know you've got things to get to where can people find you on the internet well I'm writing for Apple Insider I have my articles up on roughly drafted and my Twitter is Daniel Aaron e r an Danel Daniel Aaron great I'm at V marks on Twitter and we will be back next week with more when's the last time you upgraded your home with Wi-Fi turn your Wi-Fi up a notch with netgear's new line of Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 routers whether you're gaming online or watching Netflix in 4k it's like giving your streaming the VIP treatment you'll enjoy buffer-free streaming and zero lag no matter how many devices are connected to your network upgrade your W router at netgear.com wifi6 make your Wi-Fi feel young againyou're listening to the Apple Insider podcast all right welcome back to this episode of the Apple Insider podcast I'm Victor and joining me is Daniel eron diler from WWDC good morning from San Jose how is San Jose uh it's quite nice it got pretty hot so no need to wear a jacket most of the time except inside the conference Hall some of them are refrigerated to the point of needing to put on the on the jacket wow well at least they gave out jackets right yeah they they had a like a bomber jacket and there's several different kinds each has a different color it's a similar print but it's a different primary color so makes everybody kind of brightly a bright bunch of people yeah but that's not what listeners are here for right that's that's not one of our audience is talking about is the jacket because what they really want to know about is is what the heck is going on there right we we saw this very very big cheese grater Mac Pro we saw the Monitor and the monitor stand and a whole bunch of other things so let's start talking about that tell me about the Mac Pro well Apple took I mean wwc is obviously for developers it's where this whole Conference of they're talking about what's new and their new operating systems and the reason why the pro was announced as Hardware it's not common that there's Hardware released um but this is a product that Apple hasn't uh updated again since since 2014 I think and there were several years where it was the the can size which I think everybody realizes was sort of a mistake I mean they they created this product that was almost like a consumer product that was you know looked cute and everything but it wasn't really expandable in the way that Pro people needed wanted and so here they're kind of coming back to the design similar to the aluminum Max that came out in what 2005 or 2003 uh right the the old Power G5 yeah yeah so it's a more modular design I mean it's more of a typical kind of PC type design where you have a tremendous number of slots huge amounts of uh expansion potential using PCI you also have Thunderbolt which is basic PCI in the form of a cable um so it allows you to do very powerful things uh that's that's Apple's expansion uh interconnect basically for the MacBook Pros you can plug in multiple displays and all kinds of other things and raid devices and everything so you have both of those things on the Mac Pro uh you have you know the Bing architecture and the processors that it's using are are they're kind of overkill for most people they're they're very high-end and so it's also an expensive machine uh but so they showed that off along with a monitor which Apple doesn't really sell monitors anymore but this is doing things that you can't do with most other devices out there I mean they kind of highlighted that there was no other device that hit all the check boxs that they wanted to deliver and particularly for people who are doing 4K video so it's or um yes working with any kind of high-end video and audio and um working with tons of tracks and so the really positioning the Mac platform is being able to handle really complex tasks and workflows for Professionals for whom the price is and the primary consideration is it's a capability so this is not for consumers you know when consumers look at and they're like wow $5,000 for a Macintosh to begin with uh and then you know goes up dramatically this is not for people you know doing Excel spreadsheets this is for people who are making money with their machine yeah this is not imov right this this is something other than that right I mean Apple has their own Pro apps and they have a developer community of who make Pro apps and there's other uh developers that in other ways service people who are working in pro professional environments like that so it is relevant to developers and that's why it was presented here because they're showing that this is things you can do with our platform and now with the future we're going to be building out this this is not something that's going to sell in the you know tens of millions like iOS devices sell um so it's a very different Market but it is important for developers who work with those kinds of clients or who themselves have really crushing workflows that they need to have huge hardware for you know recompiling software and uh in huge huge environments where you're doing really complex things it's the Mac Pro is relevant to them in both directions let me ask there's there's a couple of things that stuck out to me as being interesting and unique there um one of them was after burner and the other was what looked to me to be extensions or modifications on the PCI slot can you talk to a little bit about afterburner afterburner is an optional uh card that is a fpga basically a it's basically a chip that can be programmed to do a variety of things after the fact and so there it's it's a A specialized type of processor that lets you um reprogram how it works and so Apple's initially using it to radically um speed up how fast it can do Graphics operations um I don't know what else I haven't really looked at that really closely I'm I think there's a lot of machine learning kind of compute tasks that can also handle but um what it really reminded me of was if you remember the old next Cube they had the next Dimension board that just it was I think it was maybe more expensive than the motherboard but you put it in and it just like raised the the hardware capacity of the machine just this incredible extent using specialized chips that were had you know was kind of brand new technology it's kind of along the those lines of you can put in uh you can put in sort of conventional gpus or this is a a special card that Apple's offering to really dramatically improve the performance of pro workflows now it's interesting that you brought up next because one of the other things WWDC is for is is all of the software changes for developers and it sort of occurred to me that this is is a seismic shift as a year goes as WWDC goes because it feels in a way like all of the things that were carried over from next are going away you know there's no more interface Builder project Builder that that uh the whole app kit UI kit shift that's taking place with swift UI do you sort of understand what I'm asking or what I'm saying here well um yeah conceptually it's kind of the same thing though because a lot of what next was trying to achieve and remember next was the company that Steve JS founded after he left Apple in the mid 80s so the late 80s um he called it next because it was basically the next thing after what Apple was doing in the 80s with the Macintosh and so at the beginning of the 90s they were roll at this computer of the future with an operating system of the future and a number of things that it attempted to do was to make programming easier to make graphics just tremendously more advanced where you're compositing on the screen instead of just working with B maps and a lot of the things that that it conceptually started are things that Apple later um turned into Mac OS 10 and they changed a lot of that too they they refreshed it because it was like almost 10 years later and here we are 20 years after that you know Mac OS 10 is almost 20 years old and so they're taking a lot of the ideas and bringing them into the future so the interface Builder what it was was a tool for basically generating code from a graphical uh tool so you lay out interfaces quickly and see how they worked um and at the time it was kind of revolutionary uh now it's it's not hasn't been for a while U and some of the tools that Apple's building uh have superseded what it can do but particularly what they're what they introduced this year was Swift UI which is a uh it's built upon the work that they've been doing with swift their new programming language that you know new it's five years old I think now but they're constantly working on uh developing a a language that can handle kind of the needs of the future and also dramatically uh reduce the amount of code you need to do a lot of things because the less code you have the less opportunity you have for mistakes and less things you have to correct so the the biggest demonstration they showed was for doing lists and and on on Mac OS 10 using um conventional development tools uh with Objective C if you look at Objective C code it's kind of difficult to read um it you have to very uh specifically put things in a in a very verbose kind of description of how you want your how you you want to build your interface with swift UI what it's doing is it's using the power of the switch language to um pair down a lot of the work that you're doing so that not only does it require less code to do kind of simple things like laying out a a listing of things on your on an iPhone screen that you can interact with but then it adds a lot of other functionality for free so once you do this you lay it out in this very descriptive way then the operating system and the the framework underneath it is handling a lot of the work that they're doing behind the scenes already for things like dark mode um which is a lot more complicated than just turning black to white or inverting colors there's a lot of thought that goes into the user interface in terms of like layers of how do you make how how do you let the user feel grounded and understand what's happening in animations and and all these kind of things so there's a lot of complexity for if Apple just said here's what we want it to look like and developers you do it then everyone's implementation would look a little bit different and it wouldn't be consistent and it would be a tremendous amount of work for every developer to be doing so a lot of what Apple does in terms of their platform is do all that work that's common amongst applications so that developers can focus on what they're trying to do so they get things like dark mode sort of for free when they're building with swift UI and it also works it does um things related to supporting other languages there's a lot of developers who don't you know maybe they don't know Arabic and Hebrew and they don't understand what's involved with right to left languages and so this is something that handles that kind of stuff for them um so it's kind of a progression of of what the Macintosh first delivered and then what next kind of pushed ahead and so now they're you know they're pushing the same kind of Concepts ahead in modern ways using modern tools and the modern um languages so conceptually it's kind of the same but yes it is replacing in the same way that you know QuickTime was replaced by AV kit and or AV Tools uh and everything that we kind of knew of as sort of a brand name eventually kind of goes away and is replaced by a modern version of what that was one of the things that I was thinking when I saw Swift UI was the idea that the the device becomes just a de Target and and so I was thinking about the possibility of being able to use Swift UI to write for the web for example sort of as a as a sort of modern web objects kind of idea I I don't see that there's a plan to do that um so part of the web is very useful in some ways and it's you know it's kind of obvious that how ways is useful but it's Al not useful in a number of ways and one of the things that we've kind of learned is that when you write for the web you're write you're not writing for you're writing for every browser anyone can ever think of and as that changes and as um you know originally was Microsoft they kind of controlled the web browser and they introduced whatever they wanted to introduce and then when there was more fractionization between different browsers it became more work to figure out how to do it and it was this effort to have all these standard bodies that were doing this thing together and then you have somebody else saying like hey we you know we like working with a standard body but we have a much better way to do this other thing and so they you know that's a lot of what Google is doing now with their browser is kind of like establishing themselves as the new Microsoft where they're doing a lot of things that just don't work on other browsers because Google has done something that to support you know really complex web applications and so the a lot of the open promise of the web is is just not possible to deliver someone's going to be in control of it and if you look at apps a lot of what apple is doing with apps is native it's native code that's running optimized for a specific device so on the Mac it was like Mac app is software that's designed for Macintosh and it takes very optimized use of the hardware and everything on it and it looks really nice and that's the whole thing you know works like a Mac or has this Mac look and feel software 4 um when iOS came out they developed an entirely new kind of Paradigm of software of how it interacts and everything that made sense on a small device and a touch interface and that they did the same thing you know on a little bit bigger scale with the iPad and added other features that only make sense on a device that's that big and with the premise of the web is you could build something that looks great on all of them but it doesn't we already know that web apps don't look there's a lot of disadvantages to using the web for going across platform because it's not optimized for anything and so what Apple really established they they kind of turn back this thought that everything was going to the web and Google for example is very web company that that's how they reach everybody is that they put it on a web interface and there are some advantages to doing things like that but for consumers in particular and also for pro pro users there's tremendous advantages when you have something designed so that your hardware and your software designed together to work together optimally and it's not just trying to have some sort of open thing that it's doing in a web browser so they're they're very useful things we do on the web but for most users if they have a choice between a web app and a native app they're going to choose the app because it works better and there's a lot of things you can do in an app that just don't work really well on a on a browser and a lot of browser efforts are trying to make something that's basically so complicated that or so sophisticated and complex that it's becoming like an app a native app that runs on a program so a lot of the work that Apple's doing with its platforms are really competing with the web so when Apple makes a tool it's not making a tool to also put them on the web because the features the the things that they would have to do to make at work would also destroy the value of what they actually did to make it exist all right thank thanks for answering that I know I was thinking out there a little ahead but uh and a little out there but it seemed like a thought because one of the things that we've talked about on this show in the past weeks have been things like project marzipan which I think is now Catalyst and and trying to figure out you know our iPad apps coming to the Mac what happens to what we traditionally think of as a Mac app and how does this puzzle piece fit together how does that work so the the framework for developing Mac apps which has been in place since Mac OS 10 is called appkit or yeah it's called out kit and when they developed when they basically turned when they came out with the iPhone the iPhone was basically Mac OS 10 in the shape of a mobile device but instead of calling it Macos 10 they gave it another another um name and they optimized a lot of the Frameworks so when you're building applications for an iPhone there's certain things that just don't make sense from the Mac so they got rid of those there are things that make sense on a phone that didn't make sense on the Mac so they original implementations and also because they're doing all this work they're they're rewriting this from scratch they can fix a lot of things that um could be done better than they were on the Mac And so there's a little bit of technology that washes back and forth where they do something on the iPhone and they bring it to the Mac for example the animation kit that does all the nice animations for you when Windows move around and things that was brought back to the mac and then there's also things that were created on the Mac that have come to the iPhone now we're now in in you know 10 years into iOS and there's been a lot of talk of how they going to converge the two and make them the same thing and there's a number of reasons kind of like what we're talking about the web that you don't want to do that there's there should be separate platforms I would argue there even becoming more separate right now with the introduction of iPad OS right I mean they kind of hinted that before when they came out with you know tvos and watch OS and it's like why do they have these different names they're really just iOS but they have optimizations and the point of giving it a different name is that there's a different interaction model that's significant enough to where it kind of needs its own name so that even though there's a lot of similarities there's a lot of things that are exactly the same um the way that you interact with a TV using a remote control is is very different than if you have a piece of glass that you're touching like an iPhone or an iPad and with the iPad and iPhone there's enough difference there because you have such a big difference in screen real state that you can do a lot of things with drag and drop and kind of working with multiple documents next to each other that do it's a little too cramped on a phone to make sense and so like you're saying they're they're making these different buckets so you can talk about them individually in a way that makes sense um now for iPhone and iPad there have been similar enough that they were given the same name until this year um and when you develop when you're building an app it's kind of another checkbox that you Mark and you say I want this app to also work on the iPad and then you can customize things to your iPad app that make it um make sense on an iPad what list is is another checkbox that says I want this app that works great on iPad to work on a Mac it's not emulation it's not hosting it in like a a VM or something it's not a simulator it's a real thing right so what what it does it takes your app your um on the on iOS apps are built with uiit which is just the the analog of um appkit right and they're compiled for an arm processor right so what it does is it um builds that app for the mac and on the Mac side they've built the Frameworks behind it to support that and additionally when you when you create when you take an iPad app and you make it work on the Mac which Apple first demonstrated on some of their own apps last year um and now they're doing with things like podcasts when you bring them that Mac app to the Mac it's a Mac app it was built with a little bit different tools but it doesn't make it look different it doesn't make it behave different say it's not supposed to be different and users aren't even supposed to notice it's just an app that works on the system um it was just built with a little bit different tools and the way that developers create those apps is you know procedurally a little bit different but it creates native apps and so the point is there are a million iPad apps that are customized for iPads and a lot of those would make sense to bring to the Mac however because if you have a team for example Twitter that has an iPhone app and has an iPad app for them to build an a Mac app before this year they would have to start over an appkit and do things radically different so it's a totally different program it's almost I mean it's not quite as much difference as you know building an out for Windows well it's actually a really good example signicant different it's it's a good example I was reading that someone looked at at Twitter and they they' estimated that Twitter for Mac when it was still Twitter for Mac in its last release had something like 990,000 lines of code and that Twitter for iOS has something like 1.56 million that that they've diverged that much from when they had a Mac app and an IOS app that were more similar and yeah anytime you have two different code bases they they're going to progress separately and there's it's a totally different project yeah so what Catalyst does is allows you to take the work all these companies have already put invested tremendous amounts of effort into iOS it allows them to take their work and make it into a Mac app that works like a Mac app and they can additionally add on to it Mac features that are unique to the Mac the same way that I iPad apps have features that don't work on an iPhone because they different you know different in scale and different in features and what they can do and so with Catalyst it allows teams that have like a an iOS code base to bring that to the Mac so there's millions of there's at least a million iPad apps that are already customized for iPad that a lot of those make sense on the Mac and the alternative is you either have to start from scratch and build a Mac app or you do the web which is like what Twitter's been doing on um and also Facebook and you know a lot of companies instead of building a Mac app their their Mac solution is to say here's a website oh I'm glad you brought disadvantages to that yeah I'm glad you brought up Facebook I need to to to thank our sponsors for a moment and then I want to ask you about Facebook in in a context here so you upgrade your smartphone your TV and your laptop but when's the last time you upgraded your home Wi-Fi the future of Wi-Fi is here it's time to welcome Wi-Fi 6 the Netgear Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 router gives you Ultra fast speeds and wider coverage throughout your home it's the biggest revolution in Wi-Fi ever you get four times the capacity compared to today's Wi-Fi which means you can connect more devices and stream simultaneously without impacting Wi-Fi speed and reliability the devices of today and tomorrow demand more your old Wi-Fi is timing out and you need the latest and high performance Wi-Fi that can keep up with you and your entire family if you stream your shows on services like Netflix or Hulu the newest line of high performance routers from Netgear will eliminate buffering and let you stream smoothly even in 4k it's like giving your streaming the VIP treatment if you game online lag will be a thing of the past turn your Wi-Fi up to 6 with a Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 router check it out today at Gent gear.com / wifi6 that's netgear.com swifi and the number six so you mentioned Facebook just a second ago and one of the things that they announced was the the concept of sign in with apple right and so so the way that I understand that is that for years we've had sign in with Google and you could sign into a website with a Google account and they would use ooth to go ahead and partner with Google or you could go ahead and site in sign in with Facebook and sign in with your Facebook account to sites and they would essenti use your Facebook account as your account for that site why is Apple doing this I think I know but I want you to tell me so the reason why applications do that is because there's a lot of cases where a company that's doing an app wants to have a relationship with you in some way or they're saving information for you or whatever it is um they want you to create a user account and having everyone create a user account is both a lot of work for developer because they have to manage it and it's also um something that when users start into it sometimes you're logging into something it's like when you go to Every web page and they want you to log in it's like I don't want to do this I don't care about this website so much I'm just going to like go somewhere else um and if you're an app developer the amount of people that come to your app and then walk away is a problem so you want to make it as easy as possible for them to set something up so that you can minimally serve them um and by using log into Facebook or Google they've been tapping into their social Network account so that uh when you go to an App instead of having to put in a username and all the stuff and you just sign with with Facebook and it takes you Facebook comes back and it makes it easier for the user however the downside of that is there's a lot of information that the user has it's not even clear how much information the user is giving up to to log in and we've seen a lot of abuse with with Facebook and their partners and how much data they're moving around and it starts to become a problem not only for users who are like what are you doing with this Facebook log but also for apps because when a when a developer has you login with Facebook not only are it's back to the problem of if I'm logging with Facebook it's like is that going to turn me off am I going to walk away so it's it's like another you know suboptimal solution that um creates privacy problems for the for the developer so Apple solution is instead of creating a social network of its own it's allowing users to log in using apple with their Apple ID but it's different from Facebook and that instead of handing this profile to the to the app developer it creates um sort of a token so that they can work with the user and the user is also get in control of what they're giving them so they can say here's my name or they they don't have to give you their name and they can say here's my email or they can say here's a here's a generic thing that will allow you to email me through apple and in the future I can just terminate that I can go into the to my settings and say I don't want to deal with this company anymore they're just me all the time and you can just delete it and then that company can't message you anymore and and do they get a real email or do they get a a sort of generated one just for them if the user says they don't want to share their email it gives them a like a number with it's something like Apple Ford um at Apple and so when um when they use that account to message the user and when they send that email Apple forwards it back to that user so that they get it but the user has the control to say no more of those and delete it they can also delete their whole account so it gives the user um understanding of what they're actually sharing what is gives them control of of their personal information they don't have a huge profile of data that maybe the developer is getting not clear you know and it's also better for the user because they or the developer because they're getting the opportunity to have a relationship with that customer and if they're doing the right things if they're providing a useful service then the customer want to hear from them and then they can request other information from them and uh build a relationship with that customer so it it really reduces friction for the developer it creates more um security for the user knowing that they're not just randomly connecting another whole company to all their information that they have online about them and so it's kind of a a win for both sides and as an alternative to social networks like Facebook um it's like I said it's better for the user and the developer and it reduces the amount of information that's being spread around and because Apple isn't posting all this information itself a lot of the things they've detailed about privacy is that Apple doesn't want the information so Apple's in a unique position to be able to offer this kind of security because they really don't want your data um Apple's making money on Hardware that's how they make their money and so they can uh offer security without worrying about so Apple can offer that type of security um because their business model isn't dependent upon it when we were talking about you know Smart TVs and all these other things they don't make any money those companies like barely making any money at all and that's basically the case with tablets and for most companies even with phones and with PCS and so they make their money by having all this adware that's collecting data about you TVs that you know report what you're watching and things like that and a lot of people don't like that and so I mean Apple's really playing that up as their their angle and that appeals to a lot of people because they don't want to have just like this huge cloud of information that you know might be construed the wrong way um there's there's a lot of problems that are that are not obvious from the beginning I see some of our readers will be like oh yeah I don't I don't care as long as it's free it's like then you don't know the whole picture of what's going on yeah there is a cost it's just somewhere else more problems there yeah yeah but but I can imagine that Facebook is probably not excited about this sign in with apple idea right they're they're they're probably well it's competing with their media I mean their ability to kind of control relationships with between developers and their customers but I mean I think we need to worry about Facebook they're making tons of money on ads and I I am tempted every day to leave Facebook I'm wondering what what's keeping me there it is there are some social aspects of it that are are very valuable but it's just like the the extreme cost of that kind of a system where just everything you say or everything you have online that's personal about you that you're trying to share with people is being shared with indiscriminately with everyone and I really don't like that yeah I I went through a process where I deleted all of my archives that were there like 11 years of stuff that they had that I'd posted and I I systematically went and deleted all of that and then I blocked the news feed so that I was only seeing the groups that I was in that I specifically intended to follow and then after doing that for a couple months I just went ahead and deleted the encount entirely yeah and that's for you know us old guys um young people aren't using Facebook it's just as are using a new set of apps yeah I mean it's just old old parent age people what do the kids use huh what what are this can't believe I said that last time I checked last time I checked I it's been a while hello fellow kids yeah what are we using um a lot of kids are using SnapChat which I didn't really get I've tried to use it but a lot of things that they're using and and of course um Facebook got into that and copied it to make stories for Instagram and they were very successful in knocking that off um one of the things that it seems that this younger generation behind us likes is instead of having sort of a permanent record like I have this I'm kind of a hoarder and I just can't get rid of things and I have you know I still have a a parac G5 somewhere in a box I got rid of I gotur on I got rid of the G5 and I got rid of the uh the the G4S that I had around finally but just the idea of of keeping holding on to things kind of forever and you know yeah when I was a kid we didn't have internet you know we had photos and you had boxes of photos somewhere and today there's such a wave of that you I don't think younger people are really as captivated with the idea of just having boxes of photos whether it's literal or sort of online somewhere so a lot of the things that they do is share experiences and so both Instagram stories and Snapchat are all about kind of checking in with your friends and seeing what they're doing in real time and things that in ways that are more authentic because originally the idea of sharing photos and kind of Instagram is sort of like look at me look what I'm doing doing but it's obviously kind of staged you know it's it's not authentic you know it's like here here I carefully orchestrated something where I'm not even having fun but here's this beautiful photo yeah I'm rich and I'm beautiful and you know I appli some filters to make myself look good there are people that set themselves up as influencers you know the same way that there there are actual people who are called influencers who have sponsored products people go out and buy the products and then set themselves up to look like it to try and launch themselves into becoming influencers right it's absurd that's that's kind of a a cycle of marketing that we've seen before where initially the psychology of marketing comes in and it sways an entire generation and then the generation behind them watches that occur and says wow this is really fake you know I don't I don't need Billboards everywhere telling you to drink Coca-Cola I don't even want to anymore and so advertisers have to keep you know changing their game because it becomes less effective to do the same things over and over again and we're kind of seeing that with this idea of you know look at me here's my beautiful photo of me and a fancy play with important people and it's I think there's a new it's sort of kind of driven by a desire to have authenticity so you're wanting to see not everybody you're not trying to show off for everybody but you're wanting to connect with your friends and show them you know hey this is what we did here's what we're doing right now do you want to come and hang out with us kind of thing um and I think that that's not what Facebook is designed to do yeah I think Facebook is trying to to you know obviously trying to accommodate that as well but Facebook is kind of turning into iTunes you know how it was like the cool thing for me it and then it just became more and more bloated and bigger and Huger and trying to do everything and you're like this isn't good at everything you know oh man so so first of all two questions cuz but I'm going have to do them in order so we have this apple single sign on thing how is Apple going to get developers on board with that what's what's what's the requirements here I think they make it mandatory for apps in the app store which is part of um like if your if your app signs in with social you need to add it and it's not hard to add and it's in the developer benefit because users are going to want to have it right if you're already requiring Facebook then you have to also require Sig in with apple yeah I mean I think you know they have a lot of Leverage to to make it popular among on their platform because they control the gates of the wal Garden you know yeah and that's also an issue people have been talking about is you know what should Apple have so much control and that is an interesting question I want to write more about it but one of the things that I've been thinking about recently is the alternative to one thing being in in control is something else so if you don't like apple being in control of apps which there's valid reason I know a lot of developers who are you know irritated that Apple stepped into their territory after you know letting them develop it you're talking about something like being sh locked that's sh loocking yeah that would be very frustrating however at the same time the alternative is um what if you don't have an app store or what if you don't have a company that's in charge of an app store then you have something more like Google where everything is just on fire and chaotic crap and you can't build upon it and you can't there's no business model all you can do is put ads in your app or track people there's no way to say here's an app that's useful and you can pay some significant amount for it and I can make money and you can have something that you really works for you that doesn't exist anywhere else and so we can take a power away from Apple but who who gets it do we give it to somebody else do we do like we did in the 80s and give it to Microsoft because Microsoft did a worse job um so I think people should think about the Alternatives you know it's really easy to come up with solutions to say hey shoot the rich but then who's who's next you know well you'd mentioned iTunes a minute ago and and how iTunes had grown from being doing one thing well rip mix burn to then synchronizing iPods and and then synchronizing iPhones and iPads and then apps and movies and pretty much had become this blow to do everything kind of app right right so what's happening with it so it's kind of surprising Apple didn't do this earlier but um they're taking a lot of the the features of iTunes that were kind of there because it was cross platform um so to have kind of a a similar experience across windows and the Mac they had to put all the iOS stuff into one place and now they're deciding that that's not important so the windows thing is kind of staying the same but on the Mac it's becoming a little B better organized so that uh some content that you work with differently so the way that you listen to music is similar conceptually to what you're doing when you listen to podcasts or to audiobooks or even when you're listening to the audio portion of TV or whatever but those things have we we interact with them differently so we kind of listen to music in the background and we stream music from Apple music or some people still like to buy downloads or rip their CDs those are all kind of conceptually similar in how we appreciate music TV is more of a sitting down watching something while it's happening it's intentional and so yeah and so the way that you choose what you're going to watch and all those things are different so that the browsing system is different and how you want to discover things is different as opposed to music and it's the same thing with books you you the way you appreciate an audio book is different and it's it's more similar to a book that you're going to read and podcasts are also have like their own way of interaction um and so by putting them into separate apps they can not only make the experience more consistent across the platforms so you have a podcast app that um makes sense across everything from an iPhone to Apple TV to your computer um it also um just simplifies a lot of things and then specifically on the Mac because you're pulling some types out they also say hey let's let's take the device stuff that works like a drive and put it into the finder where it belongs so when you plug your phone in or or an older iPod device it works like a drivewood and it puts out the same interface that was in iTunes before you know you put it in and it says here's your options for handling this it looks kind of identical from what I've seen I haven't worked with it extensively but so it's kind of more of just moving things and that's an example of what they're doing with uh Apple music is basically still iTunes that they give it a modern name to indicate that it's different because now it's based around Apple music subscription but you can still use it with the stuff you had before and you can still buy music and you have the option to either show or not show the iTunes Store in the sidebar so if you're using Apple music you might not care to do that unless you're trying to look up reviews and things that are unique to the the download store so we're not actually losing any functionality here right um I don't think there's anything that actually has gone away okay to think about that for a minute but I mean that's that's been one of the concerns people were worried people contacted me saying that they were worried that they weren't going to be able to continue to buy music people contacted me saying that they were worried about things like like apple taking over their music collection like uh you know they they'd heard years ago with iCloud Library iCloud music library where where they'd have a version locally and it would get synced and then their version would get lost kind of thing you know PE people are really concerned when you mess with their music well I mean part of that was because it was reported Wrong by a lot of companies that they heard something about I you know Apple was going to stop using the name iTunes yeah they stopped using the name ioto too they know it's photos and instead of calling it Tunes they're calling it song You Know music right um so it's not it's not really that crazy of a change but uh they immediately kind of jump to this conclusion to ask all these questions and a lot of it was because it was presented Wrong by the media instead of asking figing it out they tried to create this Sensational headline and this is not the first time they've done that too I mean I remember over the last couple years there was this thing of like Apple's going to kill downloads and it's like no they're not they've not indicated that at all um Apple would much rather you sell sell you download than Apple music they're making more money with downloads I think okay if you buy a lot of downloads so um yeah me a lot of it was just one of the biggest problems we have was just journalism is now based I mean it's not even journalism but it's online writing is just based around getting people upset it's not really to inform them to upset them because that drives ads better right let me put out a really really fearful fear inducing headline so that everyone reads my clicks through my article and it doesn't matter what's what's actually right or not yeah you know there a lot of articles that you know have some like scandalous headline they're just like what and then you read it and you're like first of all you didn't answer that question that you dramatically posed and second of all it doesn't really have anything to do and part of this is not even the writers sometimes you write an article and they put a headline on it that's like what yeah you're trying to boost Theo you're just making me look like a jerk yeah no I and I know people that that these things leave Lasting Impressions you know I know a person who will only buy MP3s from Amazon because they're afraid of buying music from Apple because they're afraid that it will get uh DRM never mind that DRM hasn't been a thing in what 10 years does make sense but yeah I know it doesn't make any sense except that we know that that once someone's taken on board this this position or read the article or taken the fearmongering it sticks with them well if you look at other companies I mean um Samsung's milk and Microsoft is on for a couple platforms where they just said like hey this isn't working out anymore so we're just going to dial it down and it's going to go away so it's kind of like what um who else did it there's been a number of companies that were just kind of like Hey we're changing our business model so like flicker with their photos yeah it's like hey we're gonna we're not doing this anymore this whole free thing didn't work out yeah and so when people get burned a couple times yeah they're probably thinking like Apple going to do that and uh yeah I have thought about like at what point what point will Apple keep supporting you know iPods from years ago but iPods are actually pretty simple I mean it doesn't require like a tremendous amount of effort to I mean they're a mass storage device with an iPod library on it it's not like it's a big deal yeah yeah you know and I've I've revived a number of those I put uh flash drives in them and I've got everything from the third generation forward still syncing with iTunes but outside of Apple I mean you know PCS were always kind of a thing that there are lot Microsoft has really hard to make windows work on everything kind of forever with some limitations but um a computer gets to a certain age and just can't do things anymore or can't do modern things anymore and with mobile devices it's even worse I mean like most of the world's phones are Android phones that can't get updates after 18 months yep or sooner that's why there that's why there's so many being sold you know they talk about unit sales and it's like of course you know everybody has to replace their phone they don't they don't address the turn in that figure right right and so that's why a lot of people you know they look at the numbers for example iPhones being sold in China you know Apple only has this like 177% market share or something but their share of the phones and use is actually leading you know it's like neck and neck with the biggest producer in China um so a lot of those statistics that are being presented are not really that's more examples of they're not as informative as they could be yeah let's come out with something that's shocking as opposed to Accurate or you know what what would you say is the biggest takeaway so far from WWDC the biggest takeaway yeah what has what has been the biggest change that you've seen what do you think is going to have the biggest impact down the road well as opposed to like a big change there's a lot of incremental things that are happening and every year there's incremental things and sometimes you look at and you're like why are they doing that and then the next year you're like oh that's why they did that and so a lot of things that like one of the things I was talking with a friend yesterday about was AR kit and they're like why is Apple doing all this work for air kit um you know put they're rapidly iterating on it like every year it has very sophisticated new features that are pretty incredible like the whole you know person occlusion where a person can walk through a 3D scene and the graphics are just like clipped behind them I mean magical um why is Apple doing this and it's kind of clear that Apple's not doing a just so you can have apps on your phone there's going to be glasses or or there's going to be windshields or you know there's so many uses for AR other things that have not been released yet yeah this is this is deeper than just the Ikea catalog right right and at the same time uh one of the interesting things that they that was mentioned uh was that developers who are using airkit in the most kind of the most obvious thing like you're talking about Ikea some of these partners that are building things where you can take a model and put it in your home and see it realistically at AR boost sales by 300% if somebody can place object in their house then they're like yes I'm I'm confidently going to buy this as opposed to I'm not sure my uh years ago my uncle ran an art gallery that sold art and and he would frame it and he uh he did this thing where he would loan it out to you you came and you wanted to buy something great they'd put it in your home you'd try it for a few weeks just to see that it fit fit with your lifestyle and stuff and then you'd buy it for that very reason yeah and so for for for big companies or you know for any company to be able to implement AR and get a benefit back from it that's what moves technology forward if you can find a way to make it useful and a way that pays for things there were a lot of things that Apple did in the '90s you know with QuickTime VR um it wasn't really clear what the use case was they tried to find some you know it's like here's here's a way to like go through a house that you might want to buy I remember the Volkswagen New Beetle they had a QuickTime VR movie for it and you could pan around the Beetle and see the dashboard and stuff right and it's kind of similar to arit in the sense that it was allowing you to explore 3D objects or world um arit is basically just taking that and and sinking up to the camera so you see this um 3D model in real space you a real environment um but they've worked they've kind of established a better way to sell it so a way that people are actually going to use it in a way that makes sense and people want to use it and of course they also have you know a billion devices out there as opposed to back in quick time VR it only worked on Max and kind of struggled to work on anywhere else and one of the kind of interesting things is Google figured out a way to use some of the ideas that Apple was working with with quick time VR where you could take you could make a node where you you look around 360 in a panorama click a button go ahead to this other space and and see another node from there and you have it's basically a movie that's not linear so instead of looking at a film one frame at a time along a film strip you're able to kind of look at frames in a movie and then jump to wherever else you want to go so it's kind of like h card for the for video um so the idea of panoramas and looking at models and looking at things over time Google translated that into street view so now you could be in a map you could look around you could click over there and look around from there and so they made a a valuable use case that people could do that with so now apple is doing that now they're taking their own technology and they're building it with you know they're they're now 10 years past where wherever whatever time it was that Google started with street maps so they're using a lot more advanced technology you know using lar and planes and stuff to basically create a street level version of flyover so now you're in the model and you're not just looking at photos you're looking at actual 3D you're looking at surfaces they have a 3D representation of the earth so when you're walking along you're seeing buildings that that have a 3D texture applied to them of the building pretty incredible it really is and it's it's new imagery so so I'm excited I'm excited about Maps changing and they it was pretty aggressive that they're gonna finally get the modern Maps across the entire United States this year that's cool because it seems like it's kind of been moving slow but you know this is a lot of work to model the entire United States Building at a time Maps is a big undertaking and it's been a big undertaking for anyone who's tried to do it and uh you know it's and again Apple has probably another reason for the future for map well whatever they're doing with vehicles that's going to be really kind of key with when you're to have your own map so apple is developing a lot ofch techologies that right now aren't quite so obvious what the reason why they're doing it but in the future it's going to be more obvious all right well I I don't want to keep you because I know you've got things to get to where can people find you on the internet well I'm writing for Apple Insider I have my articles up on roughly drafted and my Twitter is Daniel Aaron e r an Danel Daniel Aaron great I'm at V marks on Twitter and we will be back next week with more when's the last time you upgraded your home with Wi-Fi turn your Wi-Fi up a notch with netgear's new line of Nighthawk Wi-Fi 6 routers whether you're gaming online or watching Netflix in 4k it's like giving your streaming the VIP treatment you'll enjoy buffer-free streaming and zero lag no matter how many devices are connected to 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