The Electric Car Conundrum: A Complex Web of Benefits and Challenges

As we navigate the rapidly evolving landscape of electric vehicles, it's essential to acknowledge the intricacies involved in this technological shift. One of the most amusing aspects of electric cars is that they can be driven without ever starting the engine. This means that the car's battery remains charged overnight at home, and the owner can plug in to charge it very cheaply. The only weight penalty comes from lugging around a battery and some motors, but this is becoming less significant as technology advances.

The benefits of electric cars are undeniable, particularly for short journeys or when starting a journey. However, there's an inherent fear that comes with owning an electric vehicle – the fear of being stranded without access to charging infrastructure. Unlike petrol cars, which can easily be filled up at a nearby station, electric cars require a reliable source of electricity. This limitation is being addressed through investments in charging infrastructure, but it remains a pressing concern for many potential buyers.

Another critical aspect of electric cars is their tax implications. Governments have been offering substantial incentives to encourage the adoption of electric vehicles, which has led to a surge in demand. However, these tax breaks are set to expire soon, and manufacturers face a daunting task: meeting the increasingly stringent emissions regulations while also maintaining competitiveness. The weight of this responsibility has resulted in some manufacturers being forced to adapt their offerings significantly.

One notable example is Porsche, which has become synonymous with high-performance electric vehicles. However, the crash of several high-end EVs on the market has highlighted the challenges of producing and selling luxury electric cars. The sudden loss of demand for these vehicles has had a significant impact on sales and profitability, leaving many to wonder if they can sustain themselves in this new landscape.

The development of combustion engines has stagnated in recent years, partly due to the assumption that electric vehicles would dominate the market by 2030-2035. As a result, manufacturers have been hesitant to invest in engine development, despite the potential for significant improvements in terms of weight, size, and efficiency. This trend is also affecting synthetic fuel development, which holds promise as an alternative to traditional fossil fuels.

One of the most critical factors in understanding the electric car conundrum is recognizing the complexity of individual circumstances. What works for one person or country may not work for another. For instance, Ferrari's smaller size and production numbers mean they don't fall under the same regulatory categories as larger manufacturers like Lamborghini, which is part of the Audi and Volkswagen group.

The final verdict on electric cars remains uncertain, but it's clear that this technology will continue to shape the automotive industry in profound ways. As we navigate this transition, it's essential to acknowledge both the benefits and challenges involved, including the potential for market volatility and regulatory changes. Ultimately, only time will tell how Porsche and other manufacturers will adapt to this new landscape, and what implications this will have on consumer demand and the overall success of electric vehicles.

For now, as we conclude our exploration of the electric car conundrum, it's clear that there are many more questions waiting to be answered. We'll need to continue monitoring the development of electric vehicles, their impact on the market, and the regulations governing their production and sale. Until then, the future of mobility remains a topic of great interest and debate – and one that will undoubtedly shape our world for years to come.

In conclusion, as we reflect on the electric car conundrum, it's essential to recognize both the challenges and benefits involved in this rapidly evolving landscape. From the amusing paradox of driving an electric car without starting the engine to the pressing concerns around charging infrastructure and tax implications, there are many factors at play. As we move forward into an uncertain future, one thing is clear – only by embracing complexity and acknowledging the intricacies of individual circumstances can we truly understand the full scope of this technological shift.

Harry's Video: For those interested in delving deeper into this topic, be sure to check out Harry's video on the subject. His insights offer a unique perspective on the electric car conundrum, and his exploration is undoubtedly worth watching. As always, I hope you've enjoyed this article, and I look forward to seeing you again soon – cheers!

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enI previously owned a Porsche tyan turbos s and today we're going to find out how much money I would have lost if I still owned it and believe me it is terrifying the tyan has quickly become infamous for Hefty depreciation and mine being the flagship from the range had potential for even more disaster too I've lost a lot of money on cars like my Mercedes amgs and McLaren Center but let's figure out why this is happening so badly for the tyan and dig into what it did cost and what it would have cost me if I still owned it today hi guys I'm shme hello and welcome back to the channel let's talk tyan don't get me wrong the tyan is a fantastic car in fact back at the time we moved into the museum mine was my go-to daily driver for here in the UK lots of different Journeys and even a road trip that I took it on all the way to Germany and back but today I want to talk about values of Titans and electric cars in general what's happening with this industry plus there might be some other cars in my collection which have a pretty unfriendly future of depreciation in store for them down the line but the tyan was Porsche's First full electric car they are now making most of their lineup fully electric and that's having interesting shakeups to the industry but also the fact that governments are requiring manufacturers to go basically fully electric and not very long yet sales aren't really there 2 plus 2 is currently not equaling four so what's going to be happening next with this my only current Porsche is this my 914 which is a small fraction here and the rest at Yorkshire car restoration currently being worked on the guys are doing some amazing stuff with that but the tyan of course launched in fact back in 2015 the mission e concept was shown at the Frankfurt Motor Show I filmed it back there in fact it then arrived in pretty similar form in production spec I have a model of it here in 2019 Porsche introduced their first fully electric car the saloon large form factor boasting if you had turbo sspec 760 horsepower which is utterly Bonkers to be honest it took the entire Market by storm because up to this point all of your electric cars the likes of the Tesla Model S and different models that have arrived had all been for purist car drivers a little bit of a curveball not the same Driving Experience you'd come to expect but the tyan has been a Porsche through and through it feels like a Porsche it drives like a Porsche it just happens to be powered by electricity as opposed to petrol or diesel let me recap my tyan the turbos s the flagship but stay tuned cuz I can reveal some pretty scary numbers to you in a moment so I bought a car when it was fairly early in its life I actually bought a car that had been prpe I didn't choose the specification but there weren't a whole lot of them available because this was right at the early stage of customer cars being delivered I took delivery in gray with the dual tone Wheels like the mission e at Porsche Hatfield but very promptly took it to dub Customs to wrap the car in Midnight green the initech film looked amazing especially after we then took those Wheels to whoops will fix it to paint them in Orum gold green and gold is a winning combination especially given the car also had some gold accents on the interior we then had a lot of fun with it in a year and a bit that I owned it after that point we did some drag races against the McLaren Center smoked it off the line before the center did as you might expect eventually start to catch up being about 1,000 kilos like also took it via the nurur ring yes I did an electric lap of the nurur ring naifer in the Porsche tyan turbos as well but the car fundamentally was flawed from the point of view that if you buy the most performance variant of an EV you tend to have the least range it's not something that you can have the best of both worlds and that turned out to be a bit of a problem down the line as we're going to get to I've been very lucky that some of the cars I've bought over the years have appreciated in value although I tend not to have sold those the likes of my SLS AMG Black Series my Ford GT even the Focus RS and the GT500 but I've also owned quite a few that have plummeted off the edge of a cliff and I stand in front of the GT Black Series not because of this car but this car's predecessors my original AMG GTR the Beast of the black hell which depreciated from buying to selling by £53,000 my AMG GTR Pro that came next which depreciated from buying to selling by £55,000 my AMG G TTR Roadster that came after which also depreciated from buying to selling by £50,000 terrifying to think that those three cars alone cost over £150,000 in depreciation not including servicing Finance interest other costs involved in running them as well of course the plus side is that I'm making videos and other things going on but that wasn't a particularly friendly set of bills in fact I did an update fully talking through all of these cars that I've owned to date the ones that have lost the ones that have made money what's happened along the way another without giving you specifics has been the McLaren Center often people think hypercars only make you money whether the center is a hyper car or not is a separate discussion but having bought it for over £800,000 back at the time we sold it earlier in the year with an asking price of £ 660,000 so you can probably do the simple maths behind that one however you kind of expected a little bit more on those types of cars the direction that EVS have gone is the really really really scary one who actually buys a car like the Porsche taan and I find this very interesting so let's explain and to do so I am starting here in my daily spaces at the garage because we have the world's best daily right here the tel magenta bright pink Transit custom from msrt this is our team van and it is amazing but more realistically I'm currently dailying the newest addition to the collection the Ferrari Roma spider getting that early running in mileage done getting it ready for some fun ahead and very lucky to do so but back at the time of moving in as I said I owned the tyan now back then I lived in central London with an underground garage with no opportunity to have a charging station there I couldn't plug it in anywhere it wasn't allowed if I then went to the Chargers firstly they were quite a long way away secondly you probably end up with cues before you were able to get to the front then if you did get to the front they were potentially broken as I encountered many times if they were working they were incredibly expensive so when we moved in here as you can imagine we installed an EV charger very luckily here we have three-phase electricity so the CC charge storm connected 2 can power two cars and charge 22 KW which means a car like the tyan could go from nearly empty to nearly full in 5 or 6 hours come in for the day plug it in when it's nearly empty it would be full at the end of the day complete change to the use case of a car like that and how I could actually enjoy owning it not so many people in the country are fortunate enough to have such charging infrastructure have to rely on public charges which a nightmare or have to park on the street and can't plug it in which is its own problem so who buys one well this is where all the tax benefits come in if you are a business owner you can buy an electric car a premium EV a very expensive car and write it down at 100% of its value think about that a Tian at £160,000 instant write off of course when you come to selling it you have to add back on the value that you sell it for a little bit more complicated than that and having not expected that the whole world would fall out from under the values feet of a tyan I actually didn't do that at the time because nobody expected it to go completely off the cliff like that anyway little bit more complicated because every country is different even within countries every setup is different but with all sorts of company tax breaks advantages to do so there's been a big push towards EVS which has driven those who are quite wealthy and fortunate to do so to buy the most expensive EVs and therefore you can imagine where this is going you only get that break when you buy it new not used you going to buy a used one not really used values as a result woof off they went the cost of charging is fascinating so being lucky here on a farm we've got fixed tariffs I've got my charger installed it's very cheap and effective to charge up an electric car if you don't have that you're relying on the public infrastructure which here in the United Kingdom currently costs you in the region of about 80 to 85 P per kilowatt now in a car like the tyan Turbo S a 760 horsepower very high-end heavy electric car that will get you two and a little bit miles for some perspective to fuel my Ferrari GTC 4 lusso back at the time similarly powered 12-cylinder Ferrari Supercar luxury high-end four- seater car cost in the region of A50 a liter which gets you about 4 to 5 miles if you do the maths on that it's actually cheaper to fuel a V12 Ferrari than to charge an electric car that's equivalent not only that the petrol includes fuel Duty includes a whole lot of other taxes whereas the electric side doesn't yet think about that take off or add that fuel duty to electric car charging it's actually significantly more expensive to charge an electric car than to fuel a Ferrari what I've just given you is this really long list of reasons why EVS are a disaster the cost of electricity how hard it is to charge them the huge depreciation of cars and I sound like a complete EV hater but I want to say I'm not anti- EVS I run a number of different electric cars and it's all down to the right time and place for example if you're commuting going from A to B and you've got easy access to a charger it's a no-brainer if you're driving into a city center where pollution is a problem we all know that again it's a no-brainer if you want a luxurious comfortable calm effortless Drive Rolls-Royce Spectre I'm looking at you again it's a no-brainer but what's happened is that governments and media have created this very confusing often misunderstood environment around EVS to begin with and somebody like Harry Metar has done an amazing video about this that I recommend you watch to understand it more but effectively now we're in this strange world where manufacturers have spent billions on R&D to develop electric cars that now customers aren't really buying in the numbers that were either expected or are required by legislation we've heard many things like electric cars only from 2030 or 2035 in different regions even Volvo cars who pretty much have led one of the charges on this have recently announced that they're not going to be able to make their own targets because if customers aren't buying the electric cars manufacturers still need to develop the combustion engine cars to keep sales going to keep the business afloat with the electric cars effectively having to somehow subsidize all of this it's a very complicated economic situation that a lot of people don't really understand even down to our electric cars actually better given the cost of manufacturing we've talked a little bit about that in the past on the channel really complex really difficult to understand but it's meant that all of these high-end EVS that have now flooded to the market as people want to go back to another combustion engine car maybe it's even cheaper maybe they want a new car maybe they don't want to buy another car that's going to depreciate so heavily and now left there with nobody really buying them and the cars as a result have done this with Brands like Porsche or Ferrari when it comes to the really special cars generally if you want to get the ultimate limited edition track focused version you need to have owned some of the other stuff as well to get the sf90 XX I needed to have owned an sf90 before that with Porsche it's been known for a very long time that if you want to get a new GT3 RS you need to have bought some of the regular cars looks like we got a GT3 RS but I have got a sweeten the deal with buying three Porsche taans now so with Porsche now changing the lineup the portfolio to be the tyan the new fully electric Mancan we know the fully electric box to Cayman platform is coming the kayen is going fully electric as well all of these are losing their combustion engined cars completely if you want a Porsche GT car like the next 911 GT 3 RS GT2 RS or whatever it might be you're probably going to need to buy a bunch of these cars that you really don't want and that creates a very strange marketing position I would argue that at least in the case of the cars from Marinello all of the cars that they make are amazing So when you buy a 296 or a RoR or a Pur sangu you're driving an amazing car that is an Enthusiast you want but they're going to have a similar problem as well when they do eventually release a full EV and I'm looking forward to seeing what happens with that there'll be more on the channel I'm sure about it down the line we'll have to wait and see we don't know yet but it certainly is going to create this friction in the portfolios what's going to happen if you want the ultimate GT car are you going to have to go and buy a bunch of stuff that you really don't want to get it ladies and gentlemen are you sitting down because I certainly needed to to share some of these numbers with you back in late 2020 I sold my first Ferrari GTC foro the V12 to purchase my Porsche Tian I bought it in November 2020 less than 4 years ago remember that with 11 M on the clock brand spanking new first owner on the car and it cost me 9,563 £60 Grand for the tyan a whole lot of money and at the time I didn't think they would fall as far as they have done since I actually then owned the car for about 18 months I sold it in November 2022 with 6572 M on the clock so I did 65,000 miles and I sold it for £38,000 on the nose I lost £ 215,000 on my tyan Turbo S which sounds horrific it's a lot of money but compared to what I'm about to tell you I got very lucky with that fast forward to today current market cars that are less than 4 years old less than 4 years old that were £160,000 new with a high spec admittedly if you go to auto Trader one of the UK's biggest platforms for these kinds of cars and look for the Porsche tyan turbos s only the cheapest tyan turbos right now is asking so not even what you would actually necessarily pay it's asking £58,000 a loss of 2/3 in less than 4 years 100 Grand down now realistically my car obviously with some slightly lower mileage and higher spec would be somewhere in the low mid 60s but still effectively £100,000 down if I had never driven it again and kept it at 65,000 Mi it might stretch towards 70 but still over 90 grand down as it happens I sold my tyan Turbo to purchase another Ferrari GTC for lisso I stepped back into Ferrari's V12 Grand Tor but think about those numbers that's a lot to lose in fact bar the center that would have been to today the most I had lost on a car a single car ever with the exception of the sf90 St Al which I know will lose more than 100 except there's one big difference the sf90 at least has been well both cars were going to say are an amazing experience to own but the sf90 at least ticks some boxes with Ferrari gets me some points the tyan did absolutely zero when it comes to Porsche because the next guy who comes in and buys more cars is going to step right above you in the queue I wanted a GT4 RS at the time bought my taan bought a GT4 in fact from the same dealer as well but that's not even enough to make a Porsche dealer blink in ter terms of cars for the future so that's a lot of money to lose for not necessarily all that much something I didn't mention take out the Turbo S for a moment let's talk about all Porsche tians including those at a lower entry price point like the 4S you can now get one that's 4 years old starting from under £40,000 at that price it is the bargain of the century a luxurious comfortable performance car that's a small fraction of the cost for the original owner the reason though is that it's hampered by all of these fears of EVS in general is the battery deteriorating is it going to need an expensive replacement is the car still depreciating very heavily or even going to become completely worthless beyond that also here in the United Kingdom especially nearly every car is purchased with some form of Finance so Finance quotes are going to impact decisions if you take electric cars with lower residual values than their equivalent internal combustion engine car that means the monthly payments are going to be a little bit higher to equate for that difference which means people are going to lean in the other direction in the last few years sales of electric cars as a percentage of the total have been rising exponentially pretty much everywhere in the last year or so that has begun to taper off quite significantly against the expectations of governments car manufacturers organizations who monitor all of this type of thing and there are a few reasons for it of course this is very specific to different regions in a country like Norway they have nearly 100% uptake of new cars being fully electric and the reasons for that are nice tax breaks extra taxes that apply to internal combustion engine cars and renewable energy sources found at home which is something that's very topical itself a whole other discussion point we don't have quite the same rate here different countries will have different answers to that one we're not going to go too much into it right now there's similarly though been an increase at the same time of the sales of hybrid cars and while I'm lucky to drive some performance h hbds we're obviously talking about the more mainstream stuff but what's interesting even with these is that I can actually drive from here to home and back in full electric even with a very small battery that means quite amusingly if I go for a drive the car's been driven but the engine hasn't even been started so the fluids haven't gone through and you could argue it hasn't actually been driven in terms of keeping it regularly maintained Etc but if people remember to plug in you can charge very cheaply overnight at home and have that small range for the short Journeys or at least the start of each Journey that you do against that there is obviously the weight penalty of lugging around a battery and some Motors in a hybrid but they've grown because people then don't have the fear of will I find a charger that works am I going to get completely stuck somewhere with no ability to fix it because with a petrol car you can go to the nearest petrol station gas station get a Jerry can and just fill up 5 liters right a gallon or so and on your way you go to the next one and solve that problem with an electric car you can't just plug it into your power bank that you use your mobile phone and charge the car up very quickly that's not going to be a solution this is all changing so quickly and there are so many elements tax breaks are going to be cut right that's going to be gone soon that means manufacturers who have spent billions pretty much every manufacturer has spent billions because they've been told they have to sell full electric cars by 2030 by 2035 whatever it is all of the cars in their portfolio have to be electric they've been pointing in that direction but if customers don't buy those cars what's going to happen here there's going to be a limited number of internal combustion engine cars that are then going to have skyh high premiums in comparison to their electric equivalents to make sure that it works on the market I struggle to understand where this is going but something has to back down the downside of that is if you think about it when it comes to any of these newer cars engine development has almost stagnated they've not been spending money on it because everyone said it had to end it had to be gone within 5 years within 10 years no consideration for synthetic and E fuels which is again another topic to discuss as a result engines that could have improved in terms of weight in terms of size in terms of efficiency fuel economy haven't done because what was the reason to do so so we've almost stifled in my opinion the development of the combustion engine in recent years because nobody could really justify it and I could waffle on for hours and hours and hours about all of these topics but there are so many complex elements of each one that differ from each individual person each individual country each individual manufacturer even how they work Ferrari is a much smaller manufacturer whereas Lamborghini a part of Audi and the Volkswagen group and different rules that apply based on different production numbers whether it's series production or even limited production limited number of production runs don't generally count inside the total comp's output of vehicles that they produce in a given Year all of these very very very complicated elements that come together ultimately that means as a result and the tyan has unfortunately for Porsche become the poster child of this that high value EVS that were bought over the last couple of years have absolutely crashed tanked in market value because of the fact there were so many tax breaks for the wealthy people that could buy them individually at the beginning of this that nowadays the market determination or interest in those products just isn't there as it was it remains to be seen with Porsche with most of the lineup going electric what's that going to mean of course they're going to be great cars but if they depreciate a lot it puts people off buying them think about the time when you could buy a GT3 RS4 liter under list price because there wasn't the demand for it as soon as people know it makes money more people want to buy it and it goes the same the other way as well as soon as everybody knows it loses a lot fewer people want to take that bite and go for it it's always been the case with luxury s-classes and seven series but not to that extent not that much that quickly and that's the very scary thing about it all so I hope this has almost opened some more questions maybe we'll have a follow-up topic do go check out Harry's video as well talking about all of this and plenty of other people who have covered the topic also but for now that is all thank thank you very much for watching guys it was a pretty steep pill to swallow a big pill to swallow when it comes to the tyan but it would have been way worse if it had stayed here at the Museum after this point that's it for now though I'll see you again very soon cheersI previously owned a Porsche tyan turbos s and today we're going to find out how much money I would have lost if I still owned it and believe me it is terrifying the tyan has quickly become infamous for Hefty depreciation and mine being the flagship from the range had potential for even more disaster too I've lost a lot of money on cars like my Mercedes amgs and McLaren Center but let's figure out why this is happening so badly for the tyan and dig into what it did cost and what it would have cost me if I still owned it today hi guys I'm shme hello and welcome back to the channel let's talk tyan don't get me wrong the tyan is a fantastic car in fact back at the time we moved into the museum mine was my go-to daily driver for here in the UK lots of different Journeys and even a road trip that I took it on all the way to Germany and back but today I want to talk about values of Titans and electric cars in general what's happening with this industry plus there might be some other cars in my collection which have a pretty unfriendly future of depreciation in store for them down the line but the tyan was Porsche's First full electric car they are now making most of their lineup fully electric and that's having interesting shakeups to the industry but also the fact that governments are requiring manufacturers to go basically fully electric and not very long yet sales aren't really there 2 plus 2 is currently not equaling four so what's going to be happening next with this my only current Porsche is this my 914 which is a small fraction here and the rest at Yorkshire car restoration currently being worked on the guys are doing some amazing stuff with that but the tyan of course launched in fact back in 2015 the mission e concept was shown at the Frankfurt Motor Show I filmed it back there in fact it then arrived in pretty similar form in production spec I have a model of it here in 2019 Porsche introduced their first fully electric car the saloon large form factor boasting if you had turbo sspec 760 horsepower which is utterly Bonkers to be honest it took the entire Market by storm because up to this point all of your electric cars the likes of the Tesla Model S and different models that have arrived had all been for purist car drivers a little bit of a curveball not the same Driving Experience you'd come to expect but the tyan has been a Porsche through and through it feels like a Porsche it drives like a Porsche it just happens to be powered by electricity as opposed to petrol or diesel let me recap my tyan the turbos s the flagship but stay tuned cuz I can reveal some pretty scary numbers to you in a moment so I bought a car when it was fairly early in its life I actually bought a car that had been prpe I didn't choose the specification but there weren't a whole lot of them available because this was right at the early stage of customer cars being delivered I took delivery in gray with the dual tone Wheels like the mission e at Porsche Hatfield but very promptly took it to dub Customs to wrap the car in Midnight green the initech film looked amazing especially after we then took those Wheels to whoops will fix it to paint them in Orum gold green and gold is a winning combination especially given the car also had some gold accents on the interior we then had a lot of fun with it in a year and a bit that I owned it after that point we did some drag races against the McLaren Center smoked it off the line before the center did as you might expect eventually start to catch up being about 1,000 kilos like also took it via the nurur ring yes I did an electric lap of the nurur ring naifer in the Porsche tyan turbos as well but the car fundamentally was flawed from the point of view that if you buy the most performance variant of an EV you tend to have the least range it's not something that you can have the best of both worlds and that turned out to be a bit of a problem down the line as we're going to get to I've been very lucky that some of the cars I've bought over the years have appreciated in value although I tend not to have sold those the likes of my SLS AMG Black Series my Ford GT even the Focus RS and the GT500 but I've also owned quite a few that have plummeted off the edge of a cliff and I stand in front of the GT Black Series not because of this car but this car's predecessors my original AMG GTR the Beast of the black hell which depreciated from buying to selling by £53,000 my AMG GTR Pro that came next which depreciated from buying to selling by £55,000 my AMG G TTR Roadster that came after which also depreciated from buying to selling by £50,000 terrifying to think that those three cars alone cost over £150,000 in depreciation not including servicing Finance interest other costs involved in running them as well of course the plus side is that I'm making videos and other things going on but that wasn't a particularly friendly set of bills in fact I did an update fully talking through all of these cars that I've owned to date the ones that have lost the ones that have made money what's happened along the way another without giving you specifics has been the McLaren Center often people think hypercars only make you money whether the center is a hyper car or not is a separate discussion but having bought it for over £800,000 back at the time we sold it earlier in the year with an asking price of £ 660,000 so you can probably do the simple maths behind that one however you kind of expected a little bit more on those types of cars the direction that EVS have gone is the really really really scary one who actually buys a car like the Porsche taan and I find this very interesting so let's explain and to do so I am starting here in my daily spaces at the garage because we have the world's best daily right here the tel magenta bright pink Transit custom from msrt this is our team van and it is amazing but more realistically I'm currently dailying the newest addition to the collection the Ferrari Roma spider getting that early running in mileage done getting it ready for some fun ahead and very lucky to do so but back at the time of moving in as I said I owned the tyan now back then I lived in central London with an underground garage with no opportunity to have a charging station there I couldn't plug it in anywhere it wasn't allowed if I then went to the Chargers firstly they were quite a long way away secondly you probably end up with cues before you were able to get to the front then if you did get to the front they were potentially broken as I encountered many times if they were working they were incredibly expensive so when we moved in here as you can imagine we installed an EV charger very luckily here we have three-phase electricity so the CC charge storm connected 2 can power two cars and charge 22 KW which means a car like the tyan could go from nearly empty to nearly full in 5 or 6 hours come in for the day plug it in when it's nearly empty it would be full at the end of the day complete change to the use case of a car like that and how I could actually enjoy owning it not so many people in the country are fortunate enough to have such charging infrastructure have to rely on public charges which a nightmare or have to park on the street and can't plug it in which is its own problem so who buys one well this is where all the tax benefits come in if you are a business owner you can buy an electric car a premium EV a very expensive car and write it down at 100% of its value think about that a Tian at £160,000 instant write off of course when you come to selling it you have to add back on the value that you sell it for a little bit more complicated than that and having not expected that the whole world would fall out from under the values feet of a tyan I actually didn't do that at the time because nobody expected it to go completely off the cliff like that anyway little bit more complicated because every country is different even within countries every setup is different but with all sorts of company tax breaks advantages to do so there's been a big push towards EVS which has driven those who are quite wealthy and fortunate to do so to buy the most expensive EVs and therefore you can imagine where this is going you only get that break when you buy it new not used you going to buy a used one not really used values as a result woof off they went the cost of charging is fascinating so being lucky here on a farm we've got fixed tariffs I've got my charger installed it's very cheap and effective to charge up an electric car if you don't have that you're relying on the public infrastructure which here in the United Kingdom currently costs you in the region of about 80 to 85 P per kilowatt now in a car like the tyan Turbo S a 760 horsepower very high-end heavy electric car that will get you two and a little bit miles for some perspective to fuel my Ferrari GTC 4 lusso back at the time similarly powered 12-cylinder Ferrari Supercar luxury high-end four- seater car cost in the region of A50 a liter which gets you about 4 to 5 miles if you do the maths on that it's actually cheaper to fuel a V12 Ferrari than to charge an electric car that's equivalent not only that the petrol includes fuel Duty includes a whole lot of other taxes whereas the electric side doesn't yet think about that take off or add that fuel duty to electric car charging it's actually significantly more expensive to charge an electric car than to fuel a Ferrari what I've just given you is this really long list of reasons why EVS are a disaster the cost of electricity how hard it is to charge them the huge depreciation of cars and I sound like a complete EV hater but I want to say I'm not anti- EVS I run a number of different electric cars and it's all down to the right time and place for example if you're commuting going from A to B and you've got easy access to a charger it's a no-brainer if you're driving into a city center where pollution is a problem we all know that again it's a no-brainer if you want a luxurious comfortable calm effortless Drive Rolls-Royce Spectre I'm looking at you again it's a no-brainer but what's happened is that governments and media have created this very confusing often misunderstood environment around EVS to begin with and somebody like Harry Metar has done an amazing video about this that I recommend you watch to understand it more but effectively now we're in this strange world where manufacturers have spent billions on R&D to develop electric cars that now customers aren't really buying in the numbers that were either expected or are required by legislation we've heard many things like electric cars only from 2030 or 2035 in different regions even Volvo cars who pretty much have led one of the charges on this have recently announced that they're not going to be able to make their own targets because if customers aren't buying the electric cars manufacturers still need to develop the combustion engine cars to keep sales going to keep the business afloat with the electric cars effectively having to somehow subsidize all of this it's a very complicated economic situation that a lot of people don't really understand even down to our electric cars actually better given the cost of manufacturing we've talked a little bit about that in the past on the channel really complex really difficult to understand but it's meant that all of these high-end EVS that have now flooded to the market as people want to go back to another combustion engine car maybe it's even cheaper maybe they want a new car maybe they don't want to buy another car that's going to depreciate so heavily and now left there with nobody really buying them and the cars as a result have done this with Brands like Porsche or Ferrari when it comes to the really special cars generally if you want to get the ultimate limited edition track focused version you need to have owned some of the other stuff as well to get the sf90 XX I needed to have owned an sf90 before that with Porsche it's been known for a very long time that if you want to get a new GT3 RS you need to have bought some of the regular cars looks like we got a GT3 RS but I have got a sweeten the deal with buying three Porsche taans now so with Porsche now changing the lineup the portfolio to be the tyan the new fully electric Mancan we know the fully electric box to Cayman platform is coming the kayen is going fully electric as well all of these are losing their combustion engined cars completely if you want a Porsche GT car like the next 911 GT 3 RS GT2 RS or whatever it might be you're probably going to need to buy a bunch of these cars that you really don't want and that creates a very strange marketing position I would argue that at least in the case of the cars from Marinello all of the cars that they make are amazing So when you buy a 296 or a RoR or a Pur sangu you're driving an amazing car that is an Enthusiast you want but they're going to have a similar problem as well when they do eventually release a full EV and I'm looking forward to seeing what happens with that there'll be more on the channel I'm sure about it down the line we'll have to wait and see we don't know yet but it certainly is going to create this friction in the portfolios what's going to happen if you want the ultimate GT car are you going to have to go and buy a bunch of stuff that you really don't want to get it ladies and gentlemen are you sitting down because I certainly needed to to share some of these numbers with you back in late 2020 I sold my first Ferrari GTC foro the V12 to purchase my Porsche Tian I bought it in November 2020 less than 4 years ago remember that with 11 M on the clock brand spanking new first owner on the car and it cost me 9,563 £60 Grand for the tyan a whole lot of money and at the time I didn't think they would fall as far as they have done since I actually then owned the car for about 18 months I sold it in November 2022 with 6572 M on the clock so I did 65,000 miles and I sold it for £38,000 on the nose I lost £ 215,000 on my tyan Turbo S which sounds horrific it's a lot of money but compared to what I'm about to tell you I got very lucky with that fast forward to today current market cars that are less than 4 years old less than 4 years old that were £160,000 new with a high spec admittedly if you go to auto Trader one of the UK's biggest platforms for these kinds of cars and look for the Porsche tyan turbos s only the cheapest tyan turbos right now is asking so not even what you would actually necessarily pay it's asking £58,000 a loss of 2/3 in less than 4 years 100 Grand down now realistically my car obviously with some slightly lower mileage and higher spec would be somewhere in the low mid 60s but still effectively £100,000 down if I had never driven it again and kept it at 65,000 Mi it might stretch towards 70 but still over 90 grand down as it happens I sold my tyan Turbo to purchase another Ferrari GTC for lisso I stepped back into Ferrari's V12 Grand Tor but think about those numbers that's a lot to lose in fact bar the center that would have been to today the most I had lost on a car a single car ever with the exception of the sf90 St Al which I know will lose more than 100 except there's one big difference the sf90 at least has been well both cars were going to say are an amazing experience to own but the sf90 at least ticks some boxes with Ferrari gets me some points the tyan did absolutely zero when it comes to Porsche because the next guy who comes in and buys more cars is going to step right above you in the queue I wanted a GT4 RS at the time bought my taan bought a GT4 in fact from the same dealer as well but that's not even enough to make a Porsche dealer blink in ter terms of cars for the future so that's a lot of money to lose for not necessarily all that much something I didn't mention take out the Turbo S for a moment let's talk about all Porsche tians including those at a lower entry price point like the 4S you can now get one that's 4 years old starting from under £40,000 at that price it is the bargain of the century a luxurious comfortable performance car that's a small fraction of the cost for the original owner the reason though is that it's hampered by all of these fears of EVS in general is the battery deteriorating is it going to need an expensive replacement is the car still depreciating very heavily or even going to become completely worthless beyond that also here in the United Kingdom especially nearly every car is purchased with some form of Finance so Finance quotes are going to impact decisions if you take electric cars with lower residual values than their equivalent internal combustion engine car that means the monthly payments are going to be a little bit higher to equate for that difference which means people are going to lean in the other direction in the last few years sales of electric cars as a percentage of the total have been rising exponentially pretty much everywhere in the last year or so that has begun to taper off quite significantly against the expectations of governments car manufacturers organizations who monitor all of this type of thing and there are a few reasons for it of course this is very specific to different regions in a country like Norway they have nearly 100% uptake of new cars being fully electric and the reasons for that are nice tax breaks extra taxes that apply to internal combustion engine cars and renewable energy sources found at home which is something that's very topical itself a whole other discussion point we don't have quite the same rate here different countries will have different answers to that one we're not going to go too much into it right now there's similarly though been an increase at the same time of the sales of hybrid cars and while I'm lucky to drive some performance h hbds we're obviously talking about the more mainstream stuff but what's interesting even with these is that I can actually drive from here to home and back in full electric even with a very small battery that means quite amusingly if I go for a drive the car's been driven but the engine hasn't even been started so the fluids haven't gone through and you could argue it hasn't actually been driven in terms of keeping it regularly maintained Etc but if people remember to plug in you can charge very cheaply overnight at home and have that small range for the short Journeys or at least the start of each Journey that you do against that there is obviously the weight penalty of lugging around a battery and some Motors in a hybrid but they've grown because people then don't have the fear of will I find a charger that works am I going to get completely stuck somewhere with no ability to fix it because with a petrol car you can go to the nearest petrol station gas station get a Jerry can and just fill up 5 liters right a gallon or so and on your way you go to the next one and solve that problem with an electric car you can't just plug it into your power bank that you use your mobile phone and charge the car up very quickly that's not going to be a solution this is all changing so quickly and there are so many elements tax breaks are going to be cut right that's going to be gone soon that means manufacturers who have spent billions pretty much every manufacturer has spent billions because they've been told they have to sell full electric cars by 2030 by 2035 whatever it is all of the cars in their portfolio have to be electric they've been pointing in that direction but if customers don't buy those cars what's going to happen here there's going to be a limited number of internal combustion engine cars that are then going to have skyh high premiums in comparison to their electric equivalents to make sure that it works on the market I struggle to understand where this is going but something has to back down the downside of that is if you think about it when it comes to any of these newer cars engine development has almost stagnated they've not been spending money on it because everyone said it had to end it had to be gone within 5 years within 10 years no consideration for synthetic and E fuels which is again another topic to discuss as a result engines that could have improved in terms of weight in terms of size in terms of efficiency fuel economy haven't done because what was the reason to do so so we've almost stifled in my opinion the development of the combustion engine in recent years because nobody could really justify it and I could waffle on for hours and hours and hours about all of these topics but there are so many complex elements of each one that differ from each individual person each individual country each individual manufacturer even how they work Ferrari is a much smaller manufacturer whereas Lamborghini a part of Audi and the Volkswagen group and different rules that apply based on different production numbers whether it's series production or even limited production limited number of production runs don't generally count inside the total comp's output of vehicles that they produce in a given Year all of these very very very complicated elements that come together ultimately that means as a result and the tyan has unfortunately for Porsche become the poster child of this that high value EVS that were bought over the last couple of years have absolutely crashed tanked in market value because of the fact there were so many tax breaks for the wealthy people that could buy them individually at the beginning of this that nowadays the market determination or interest in those products just isn't there as it was it remains to be seen with Porsche with most of the lineup going electric what's that going to mean of course they're going to be great cars but if they depreciate a lot it puts people off buying them think about the time when you could buy a GT3 RS4 liter under list price because there wasn't the demand for it as soon as people know it makes money more people want to buy it and it goes the same the other way as well as soon as everybody knows it loses a lot fewer people want to take that bite and go for it it's always been the case with luxury s-classes and seven series but not to that extent not that much that quickly and that's the very scary thing about it all so I hope this has almost opened some more questions maybe we'll have a follow-up topic do go check out Harry's video as well talking about all of this and plenty of other people who have covered the topic also but for now that is all thank thank you very much for watching guys it was a pretty steep pill to swallow a big pill to swallow when it comes to the tyan but it would have been way worse if it had stayed here at the Museum after this point that's it for now though I'll see you again very soon cheers\n"