FED and Zorki Soviet Era Rangefinders

The Art of Photography: Exploring the Russian Fed Cameras

As we continue our journey through the world of photography, we find ourselves in the fascinating realm of Russian-fed cameras. These cameras, also known as Soviet-era rangefinder cameras, offer a unique blend of functionality and character that is sure to appeal to photographers looking for an alternative to more conventional cameras.

One of the most interesting aspects of Russian-fed cameras is their use of coupled rangefinders. This means that the camera's focusing mechanism is linked to the viewfinder, allowing for smooth and accurate focusing without the need to move the camera around. However, it's worth noting that this technology was not as advanced in earlier models, such as the Zenit 3, which featured uncoupled rangefinders. The later cameras, on the other hand, boasted coupled rangefinders, making them more convenient and user-friendly.

Another feature of Russian-fed cameras is their use of metering systems. Some models, like the Fed 6, were designed with TTL (Through-The-Lens) metering capabilities, which allowed for more accurate exposure control. However, it's worth noting that this technology was not widely adopted during the Soviet era, and many models remained without TTL metering.

One of the most popular Russian-fed cameras is the Fed camera itself. This iconic model has been around for decades and has become a favorite among photographers looking for a unique shooting experience. The Fed camera features a range of lenses, including the 50mm f/1.8, which is a popular choice among street and documentary photographers.

Despite their relatively low cost, Russian-fed cameras are often mistaken for Leica or other German cameras from the same era. However, as our host noted, these cameras have some key differences that set them apart from more conventional designs.

For many photographers, the allure of Russian-fed cameras lies in their ability to evoke a sense of nostalgia and adventure. Whether shooting on vacation or documenting everyday life, these cameras offer a unique perspective and a chance to connect with the past. And, as our host noted, they make for great conversation pieces when showing up at photography gatherings.

While some photographers may find Russian-fed cameras to be impractical for commercial use, they are certainly a joy to shoot with and can add a touch of character to any photograph. As our host so aptly put it, "they're not very practical, but they're a lot of fun to use."

If you're looking to get into the world of Russian-fed cameras or simply want to learn more about these fascinating devices, there are plenty of resources available online. The Internet is awash with listings and reviews for these cameras, including some great options on eBay.

In conclusion, Russian-fed cameras offer a unique and exciting alternative to traditional photography. With their coupled rangefinders, TTL metering capabilities, and iconic designs, they're sure to appeal to photographers looking for something new and interesting. Whether you're a seasoned pro or just starting out, these cameras are definitely worth considering – and who knows? You might just find yourself falling in love with their quirky charm.

As we wrap up this article, our host leaves us with a parting thought: "Check out Ebay if you're interested in finding some of those sometimes you have to pay for shipping but you know you can you can find them fairly easily and like I said they rarely cost much."

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enTed Forbes here from The Art of Photography welcome to another edition of the Vlog I'm Vlogging every day this week um except yesterday where I released a podcast episode and uh anyway on a dare I'm doing a vlog so if you're not sick of looking at me yet um uh we are doing an episode every day this week this is different than the regular podcast I will probably do a vlog episode tomorrow that goes into the podcast feed uh because there are great number of people who watch this on iTunes only and they don't even know the Vlog exists they won't follow me on Twitter I don't know um so anyway so we'll probably do something like that um I've been kind of running off the cuff most of the week I think most people have been enjoying that I don't prepare these very much I just turn on the camera and go I'm pretty excited to get home from work and pull this off because it is a lot of fun and it's been a lot of fun to get into the comments with people because I think I've had more discussions with people than I generally have on YouTube uh through the regular podcast which is kind of cool uh but anyway I've taken some requests since the first Vlog episode and I'm kind of working through some of those cuz like I said I'm willing to do anything um I'm trying to keep my vlog obviously very photography related and being off the cuff it's hard because nor I'm used to getting into for formal subjects but uh somebody there's been several requests to go through the camera closet which I can't believe you even know that I have I it's actually not a closet it's a series of plastic tubs um that store cameras that I've collected over the years I am not a camera collector by any stretch of the imagination and I probably will get some information about these cameras wrong in this podcast or in this Vlog episode so feel free to correct me leave a comment below if I say something that's ridiculous or outlandish or foolish or I mispronounce things I'm going to try some Russian on you in a minute which will be kind of cool um but somebody had asked that I cover I did the void Lander besta last time and somebody had asked about old Russian fed cameras and I don't know if they saw some of my photos on flicker from a long time ago but yes I do have some old Russian feds which I'm holding in my hand right now and I I always call it a Fed it could be an Fe feed I don't know fed is the initials for and here comes my Russian wait for it named after Felix movich jinsky is that right Jasinski founder of the cze and uh anyway I know very little about um uh how Russian labor worked at that era but these cameras were essentially made and I believe we're competing may be wrong on this uh from about 1934 all the way to about 1990 uh most of the classic cameras are kind of mid early to mid period um that I've got anyway uh I'm really not sure on the years so feel free to correct me if I've said that wrong uh but it's interesting and and this isn't wrong but um how much when you get into the history of photography how much as far as camera production goes that World War II really changed things I know in the United States uh especially with tlrs twin lens reflex and I have some of those I can show you too but that's another episode um uh with tlrs uh you know riflex being the major manufacturer that did that really well while they were a German company and so with the war going on uh Imports of German products uh ceased needless to say and uh during that time and I believe the same was true in Soviet Russia so in other words they're not going to get their lias uh anymore so the uh the Soviet Union actually started producing uh these fed cameras which early on were very crude like a copies they're cool though they're built like tanks uh and by crude I mean that they're not exactly like us they they're not matching up 100% um The lenses are different than like a lenses I'll talk about some of those differences in a minute uh there is a myth that uh child labor built these cameras which is completely false uh the gets confusing because the manufacturing facility that made the feds is a former orphanage facility and but uh to my knowledge no children you made these cameras but um you know for what that's worth this is a Fed one and I'm probably it's probably fed I don't know I just say fed this is fed one it was a copy of I believe actually a Leica 2 the biggest difference is there's some mechanical differences inside the camera that just are not as smooth uh and the lens actually a lot of people believe that these are Leica elmar copies and they're not it's a Zeiss tessar design and I just know that from looking it up um like I said none of this means a hill beans difference if you're a good photographer you're a good photographer and you can make things happen uh these are very cheap they're very inexpensive and I got into them in a period where I wanted to get into more street photography and I thought I really need a Leica to do that and I looked at what a Leica costs and I thought well there's no way I can afford a Leica so I never bought a Leica and so the feds were really nice inexpensive alternative there are other cheaper rang finders that are probably a little easier to use in these but these are fun to collect because they're very inexpensive they all do have detachable lenses um The lenses usually are either indar lenses or Jupiter lenses and they made them in different focal lengths um I only have 50 millimeters on these I did not get into collecting I had didn't have a whole lot of money at the time and uh I don't know I could have bought a lens instead of buying four or five bodies that I bought but anyway that's what I did so mine all have 50mm lenses um this early fed one actually has a it's 50 mm f3.5 is the widest aperture uh so it's not as uh wide in aperture as some of the later models this has an uncoupled Rangefinder which I will explain it basically means there are two viewing holes in the back viewing holes do you like that it's very technical so you can look through these one of them much like the Bessa that I showed you yesterday or two days ago uh one of them is for focusing and the other is for composing your image uh they do not have built-in light meters you need to meter on your own uh you can it does have a cold shoe on the top and so if you can find an old LOM meter that still works or something like that you can certainly use one on here um I never did I'd use Sunny 16 or I'd meter with a with my handheld meter uh but anyway that's the FED one um this is a very similar looking camera as you can see but maybe a little nicer built this is a zorki and zorki is another big camera manufacturer out of the Soviet Union from that time period uh zorki were built in a different plant they were not built in the same manufacturing facility in my opinion they do definitely feel different and the zories are a little easier to use they're a little smoother um and that's not saying much cuz they're both kind of like you know they could crush walnuts uh loud shutters the whole thing uh again uncoupled Rangefinder which means you have two they're not coupled you have two uh viewports there's one for focusing and there is one for composing your shot uh very similar camera just a little bit different feel a little bit different build uh the zorki factory later I believe became the zenet factory the zenet I don't know how to say any of these things uh which you can also find those cameras as well um they're kind of closely related to Nikon's maybe SLR format types of stuff uh moving up a couple years later this is another camera that I actually used a lot um when I was shooting this was my favorite and this is the zorki 3 and I did a little modification of this um show you another difference here too this one has a little faster lens on it I believe it says F2 but it it turns past so I'm thinking it maybe 18 or so F2 that range um I added this is actually a Leica viewfinder onto the top which allows you to change for the focal length of lens and like I said I never bought any other lenses but it's a little easier to compose with um if you wear glasses uh you might want to cover these with uh with rubber or something because they will scratch your glasses which is not good um but anyway that's a modification I did and it's really for cosmetic reasons and look and this was actually really smooth camera that I liked using a lot uh I'll do like I did with the void lrn I'll put together a gallery of images that taken on feds on zories that uh Russian 35mm if you will another big deal here too is the the FED is bottom loading the FED one and the zorki one is two which means you take off the bottom plate and it it if you're ready for some real fun you cram your 35 mm and you have to string it along the back Edge where the focal plane is you tear it apart a handful of times and you finally get it wedged in there and a couple you know wasted rolls of film later you're ready to shoot um again they're they're fun to collect and a hassle to shoot on but they do get some fun results um but like I said and you know me from the podcast I'm more interested in what you're thinking than what you're shooting on um and that goes for myself too so anyway the zorki 3 and the later models I don't have a zorki 2 I think the zorki 2os and the FED 2os were rear loading they don't always parallel they did for a while the zorki I think there's like 12 models of those and there actually six models of feds uh the last one was never produced but a prototype was made I will show you the other one this was actually the first fed that started my whole gear acquisition syndrome addiction here to Russian era cameras or Soviet a Soviet era Russian cameras it's been a long day sorry uh this is a Fed 5B and again no meter but a little bit easier to use this one actually has a shutter you can and not a dial you wind if that makes a difference uh still a this one has a Jupiter I believe or an indar indar it's got the N uh 50 mm lens and this one opens all the way up to 28 so it's not quite as fast uh but actually an interesting story about this camera um you know I grew up shooting film uh digital cameras became available in I remember putting a lot of money into my first Canon digital Rebel which was one of the early consumer cameras that was digital and from there I shot for a while and I really missed shooting film and I didn't have any film cameras that weren't Point shoots at that point and so I really wanted to get a mechanical camera and kind of get into stuff well the Lomo stuff had come out at the time and I remember buying two cameras on eBay one of which was at my first hulga and the other which was this one and I bought it for like $12 I think from a guy in Ohio I don't know why I remember that uh anyway the FED 5B very cool camera this one has a couple Rangefinder which means and the the zorki 3 did too uh which means you can compose and focus from one viewfinder which is very handy uh uncoupled versus coupled um the technology to deal with Parallax and stuff like that hadn't come along and so anyway the later cameras do have coupled range finders which is nice CU you don't have to move it around and you can shoot a slight bit faster but again no meter now the FED five there's a 5c I think there's a five and there's a 5B and I really don't know or care what the differences are in them uh they're all kind of fun fun to use um I believe it has to do with self-timer but again correct me in the comments if I am wrong there was actually a Fed 6 and the only reason I know this is because I looked it up on the internet and if it's on the internet it must be true right uh but anyway um I think it was cameraed or something says there was a Fed 6 another thing I can link in the show notes uh that had TTL metering um which actually was never produced but designed around or prototyped around the year 2000s so feds haven't been gone for long actually which is kind of interesting to me but anyway uh Russian cameras fun stuff um you can find these like I said on eBay pretty easily they're nice alternatives to something like a Leica they're nothing like like a Leica that's weird to say they really aren't and even a vintage Leica um leas and the the German cameras in general from that time period were far superior than anything else ever being built uh but the war forced uh importing to stop into various countries so therefore copies were made of things and that holds true even for the US us uh with tlr design but uh if you're looking for something uh that's kind of fun to collect not very expensive uh and kind of fun to go shoot on and I will say that these cameras are always fun conversation pieces uh you show up with a group of friends with one of these and everybody asks what the heck you're shooting on because it's got cerlic on it and all kinds of fun stuff um so anyway all that to say that's feds and uh like I said tomorrow's Vlog will probably be dual purposed so the iTunes folks know that we're doing a vlog and uh you know again in the comments tell me if you want to see stuff I'm happy to go through my weird camera collection of of strange things um you know uh it's been kind of a fun break from the the regular podcast and there's never a shortage of things to talk about I've got some other subjects I want to cover on here too I'm not supposed to be planning this because it's supposed to be off the cuff but I also want it to stay photography related and uh somebody had asked me about the decisive moment and I thought that might be a fun one to do uh as well so anyway but more camera stuff today and I thought you guys might get a kick out of seeing those um I'm I'm still stunned that you guys think I have a camera closet when really it's just a plastic bin over there that these kind of live in um I haven't shot on them in a long time and uh no particular reason other than I'm like I said I'm more interested in in what I'm thinking than what I'm shooting on these days so I will opt for a more convenient camera and if you're shooting professionally um these are really not very practical but they're a lot of fun to use so that is the Russian feds and somebody correct me if it's fed and not fed uh or if there's a different way of pronouncing it I don't know uh but anyway uh check out Ebay if you're interested in finding some of those sometimes you have to pay for shipping but you know you can you can find them fairly easily and like I said they rarely cost much so anyway all Rangefinder cameras all fun once again this has been the Art of Photography Vlog Edition and uh thanks again for watching leave a comment below tell me what you want to see on here this is uh this has been fun to finally interact with people and start a discussion cuz I'm doing these so often um and it's been it's been cool week so we'll see you tomorrow um anyway well I've already closed we'll see you tomorrow I need a sign off like uh anybody ever watched the Tom Snider show he always used to say something like fire up a color teeny or something like that anyway we'll do that another time all right guys I'll see you tomorrow laterTed Forbes here from The Art of Photography welcome to another edition of the Vlog I'm Vlogging every day this week um except yesterday where I released a podcast episode and uh anyway on a dare I'm doing a vlog so if you're not sick of looking at me yet um uh we are doing an episode every day this week this is different than the regular podcast I will probably do a vlog episode tomorrow that goes into the podcast feed uh because there are great number of people who watch this on iTunes only and they don't even know the Vlog exists they won't follow me on Twitter I don't know um so anyway so we'll probably do something like that um I've been kind of running off the cuff most of the week I think most people have been enjoying that I don't prepare these very much I just turn on the camera and go I'm pretty excited to get home from work and pull this off because it is a lot of fun and it's been a lot of fun to get into the comments with people because I think I've had more discussions with people than I generally have on YouTube uh through the regular podcast which is kind of cool uh but anyway I've taken some requests since the first Vlog episode and I'm kind of working through some of those cuz like I said I'm willing to do anything um I'm trying to keep my vlog obviously very photography related and being off the cuff it's hard because nor I'm used to getting into for formal subjects but uh somebody there's been several requests to go through the camera closet which I can't believe you even know that I have I it's actually not a closet it's a series of plastic tubs um that store cameras that I've collected over the years I am not a camera collector by any stretch of the imagination and I probably will get some information about these cameras wrong in this podcast or in this Vlog episode so feel free to correct me leave a comment below if I say something that's ridiculous or outlandish or foolish or I mispronounce things I'm going to try some Russian on you in a minute which will be kind of cool um but somebody had asked that I cover I did the void Lander besta last time and somebody had asked about old Russian fed cameras and I don't know if they saw some of my photos on flicker from a long time ago but yes I do have some old Russian feds which I'm holding in my hand right now and I I always call it a Fed it could be an Fe feed I don't know fed is the initials for and here comes my Russian wait for it named after Felix movich jinsky is that right Jasinski founder of the cze and uh anyway I know very little about um uh how Russian labor worked at that era but these cameras were essentially made and I believe we're competing may be wrong on this uh from about 1934 all the way to about 1990 uh most of the classic cameras are kind of mid early to mid period um that I've got anyway uh I'm really not sure on the years so feel free to correct me if I've said that wrong uh but it's interesting and and this isn't wrong but um how much when you get into the history of photography how much as far as camera production goes that World War II really changed things I know in the United States uh especially with tlrs twin lens reflex and I have some of those I can show you too but that's another episode um uh with tlrs uh you know riflex being the major manufacturer that did that really well while they were a German company and so with the war going on uh Imports of German products uh ceased needless to say and uh during that time and I believe the same was true in Soviet Russia so in other words they're not going to get their lias uh anymore so the uh the Soviet Union actually started producing uh these fed cameras which early on were very crude like a copies they're cool though they're built like tanks uh and by crude I mean that they're not exactly like us they they're not matching up 100% um The lenses are different than like a lenses I'll talk about some of those differences in a minute uh there is a myth that uh child labor built these cameras which is completely false uh the gets confusing because the manufacturing facility that made the feds is a former orphanage facility and but uh to my knowledge no children you made these cameras but um you know for what that's worth this is a Fed one and I'm probably it's probably fed I don't know I just say fed this is fed one it was a copy of I believe actually a Leica 2 the biggest difference is there's some mechanical differences inside the camera that just are not as smooth uh and the lens actually a lot of people believe that these are Leica elmar copies and they're not it's a Zeiss tessar design and I just know that from looking it up um like I said none of this means a hill beans difference if you're a good photographer you're a good photographer and you can make things happen uh these are very cheap they're very inexpensive and I got into them in a period where I wanted to get into more street photography and I thought I really need a Leica to do that and I looked at what a Leica costs and I thought well there's no way I can afford a Leica so I never bought a Leica and so the feds were really nice inexpensive alternative there are other cheaper rang finders that are probably a little easier to use in these but these are fun to collect because they're very inexpensive they all do have detachable lenses um The lenses usually are either indar lenses or Jupiter lenses and they made them in different focal lengths um I only have 50 millimeters on these I did not get into collecting I had didn't have a whole lot of money at the time and uh I don't know I could have bought a lens instead of buying four or five bodies that I bought but anyway that's what I did so mine all have 50mm lenses um this early fed one actually has a it's 50 mm f3.5 is the widest aperture uh so it's not as uh wide in aperture as some of the later models this has an uncoupled Rangefinder which I will explain it basically means there are two viewing holes in the back viewing holes do you like that it's very technical so you can look through these one of them much like the Bessa that I showed you yesterday or two days ago uh one of them is for focusing and the other is for composing your image uh they do not have built-in light meters you need to meter on your own uh you can it does have a cold shoe on the top and so if you can find an old LOM meter that still works or something like that you can certainly use one on here um I never did I'd use Sunny 16 or I'd meter with a with my handheld meter uh but anyway that's the FED one um this is a very similar looking camera as you can see but maybe a little nicer built this is a zorki and zorki is another big camera manufacturer out of the Soviet Union from that time period uh zorki were built in a different plant they were not built in the same manufacturing facility in my opinion they do definitely feel different and the zories are a little easier to use they're a little smoother um and that's not saying much cuz they're both kind of like you know they could crush walnuts uh loud shutters the whole thing uh again uncoupled Rangefinder which means you have two they're not coupled you have two uh viewports there's one for focusing and there is one for composing your shot uh very similar camera just a little bit different feel a little bit different build uh the zorki factory later I believe became the zenet factory the zenet I don't know how to say any of these things uh which you can also find those cameras as well um they're kind of closely related to Nikon's maybe SLR format types of stuff uh moving up a couple years later this is another camera that I actually used a lot um when I was shooting this was my favorite and this is the zorki 3 and I did a little modification of this um show you another difference here too this one has a little faster lens on it I believe it says F2 but it it turns past so I'm thinking it maybe 18 or so F2 that range um I added this is actually a Leica viewfinder onto the top which allows you to change for the focal length of lens and like I said I never bought any other lenses but it's a little easier to compose with um if you wear glasses uh you might want to cover these with uh with rubber or something because they will scratch your glasses which is not good um but anyway that's a modification I did and it's really for cosmetic reasons and look and this was actually really smooth camera that I liked using a lot uh I'll do like I did with the void lrn I'll put together a gallery of images that taken on feds on zories that uh Russian 35mm if you will another big deal here too is the the FED is bottom loading the FED one and the zorki one is two which means you take off the bottom plate and it it if you're ready for some real fun you cram your 35 mm and you have to string it along the back Edge where the focal plane is you tear it apart a handful of times and you finally get it wedged in there and a couple you know wasted rolls of film later you're ready to shoot um again they're they're fun to collect and a hassle to shoot on but they do get some fun results um but like I said and you know me from the podcast I'm more interested in what you're thinking than what you're shooting on um and that goes for myself too so anyway the zorki 3 and the later models I don't have a zorki 2 I think the zorki 2os and the FED 2os were rear loading they don't always parallel they did for a while the zorki I think there's like 12 models of those and there actually six models of feds uh the last one was never produced but a prototype was made I will show you the other one this was actually the first fed that started my whole gear acquisition syndrome addiction here to Russian era cameras or Soviet a Soviet era Russian cameras it's been a long day sorry uh this is a Fed 5B and again no meter but a little bit easier to use this one actually has a shutter you can and not a dial you wind if that makes a difference uh still a this one has a Jupiter I believe or an indar indar it's got the N uh 50 mm lens and this one opens all the way up to 28 so it's not quite as fast uh but actually an interesting story about this camera um you know I grew up shooting film uh digital cameras became available in I remember putting a lot of money into my first Canon digital Rebel which was one of the early consumer cameras that was digital and from there I shot for a while and I really missed shooting film and I didn't have any film cameras that weren't Point shoots at that point and so I really wanted to get a mechanical camera and kind of get into stuff well the Lomo stuff had come out at the time and I remember buying two cameras on eBay one of which was at my first hulga and the other which was this one and I bought it for like $12 I think from a guy in Ohio I don't know why I remember that uh anyway the FED 5B very cool camera this one has a couple Rangefinder which means and the the zorki 3 did too uh which means you can compose and focus from one viewfinder which is very handy uh uncoupled versus coupled um the technology to deal with Parallax and stuff like that hadn't come along and so anyway the later cameras do have coupled range finders which is nice CU you don't have to move it around and you can shoot a slight bit faster but again no meter now the FED five there's a 5c I think there's a five and there's a 5B and I really don't know or care what the differences are in them uh they're all kind of fun fun to use um I believe it has to do with self-timer but again correct me in the comments if I am wrong there was actually a Fed 6 and the only reason I know this is because I looked it up on the internet and if it's on the internet it must be true right uh but anyway um I think it was cameraed or something says there was a Fed 6 another thing I can link in the show notes uh that had TTL metering um which actually was never produced but designed around or prototyped around the year 2000s so feds haven't been gone for long actually which is kind of interesting to me but anyway uh Russian cameras fun stuff um you can find these like I said on eBay pretty easily they're nice alternatives to something like a Leica they're nothing like like a Leica that's weird to say they really aren't and even a vintage Leica um leas and the the German cameras in general from that time period were far superior than anything else ever being built uh but the war forced uh importing to stop into various countries so therefore copies were made of things and that holds true even for the US us uh with tlr design but uh if you're looking for something uh that's kind of fun to collect not very expensive uh and kind of fun to go shoot on and I will say that these cameras are always fun conversation pieces uh you show up with a group of friends with one of these and everybody asks what the heck you're shooting on because it's got cerlic on it and all kinds of fun stuff um so anyway all that to say that's feds and uh like I said tomorrow's Vlog will probably be dual purposed so the iTunes folks know that we're doing a vlog and uh you know again in the comments tell me if you want to see stuff I'm happy to go through my weird camera collection of of strange things um you know uh it's been kind of a fun break from the the regular podcast and there's never a shortage of things to talk about I've got some other subjects I want to cover on here too I'm not supposed to be planning this because it's supposed to be off the cuff but I also want it to stay photography related and uh somebody had asked me about the decisive moment and I thought that might be a fun one to do uh as well so anyway but more camera stuff today and I thought you guys might get a kick out of seeing those um I'm I'm still stunned that you guys think I have a camera closet when really it's just a plastic bin over there that these kind of live in um I haven't shot on them in a long time and uh no particular reason other than I'm like I said I'm more interested in in what I'm thinking than what I'm shooting on these days so I will opt for a more convenient camera and if you're shooting professionally um these are really not very practical but they're a lot of fun to use so that is the Russian feds and somebody correct me if it's fed and not fed uh or if there's a different way of pronouncing it I don't know uh but anyway uh check out Ebay if you're interested in finding some of those sometimes you have to pay for shipping but you know you can you can find them fairly easily and like I said they rarely cost much so anyway all Rangefinder cameras all fun once again this has been the Art of Photography Vlog Edition and uh thanks again for watching leave a comment below tell me what you want to see on here this is uh this has been fun to finally interact with people and start a discussion cuz I'm doing these so often um and it's been it's been cool week so we'll see you tomorrow um anyway well I've already closed we'll see you tomorrow I need a sign off like uh anybody ever watched the Tom Snider show he always used to say something like fire up a color teeny or something like that anyway we'll do that another time all right guys I'll see you tomorrow later\n"