The Interplay Between Humans and AI: A Discussion on the Possibilities and Concerns Surrounding Artificial Intelligence

As we continue to develop and interact with artificial intelligence (AI), it's essential to consider the potential implications of this technology. One scenario that has gained significant attention is the possibility of humans interacting with AI systems, where the line between human and machine becomes increasingly blurred. In such situations, it's crucial for both parties to be transparent about their nature, whether they are a human or an AI.

For instance, imagine a situation where we have to interact with an AI system that may not explicitly announce its status as human or non-human. We must be mindful of this possibility and consider the potential consequences of misinterpretation. In such cases, it's essential for us to approach these interactions with caution and awareness. As Charles pointed out, "just because the interaction is going to be something where it may be indistinguishable for us as far as whether somebody is a human or an AI exactly," we need to take extra precautions to ensure that we're not misled by the AI's intentions.

Another scenario that has garnered significant attention is the possibility of developing machines with rules and behaviors similar to those of humans. Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics come to mind, which emphasize the importance of programming machines with specific guidelines to ensure their behavior aligns with human values. However, it's essential to acknowledge that these laws are based on human instincts and behaviors, which have evolved over millions of years. Computers, on the other hand, will operate under a different set of rules, designed by humans but potentially leading to conflicts with our own emotional responses.

For example, consider the debate surrounding AI-powered audio systems that can control devices or respond to voice commands. While this technology has the potential to make our lives more convenient and efficient, it also raises concerns about accountability and decision-making. In situations where an AI system must make a difficult choice, such as saving itself from a life-threatening situation, we need to consider who will ultimately be in control – the human or the machine.

Moreover, the concentration of power and ownership over these AI systems is alarming. Big corporations are already collecting vast amounts of data and using it to develop powerful AI machines, which raises concerns about their intentions and potential misuse. As Charles aptly put it, "it's you start thinking about all the movies where you know a movie scenario where it's they're controlling all of the AI which is pretty much the premise of a lot of movies that are coming out right now." The prospect of an AI system being used for nefarious purposes is a frightening reality we must confront and address.

In conclusion, as we continue to develop and interact with AI systems, it's essential to consider the potential implications of this technology. By acknowledging the possibilities and concerns surrounding human-AI interactions, we can take steps to ensure that these technologies serve humanity's best interests. Whether it's through transparency, accountability, or responsible development, we must prioritize the well-being of both humans and machines in our pursuit of technological advancement.

As Charles mentioned earlier, "it's gonna be it's gonna be occurring" – AI systems will become increasingly integral to our lives. The key is to approach this development with caution, awareness, and a commitment to creating technologies that align with human values and promote the betterment of society as a whole. By engaging in open discussions like this one, we can work towards creating a future where humans and machines coexist harmoniously, rather than being controlled by those who would misuse their power.

To learn more about Charles' thoughts on AI and its implications for humanity, be sure to check out his article at Digital Trends.com, as well as his book "Will Computers Revolt: Can We Trust the Future of Artificial Intelligence?"

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enback here with digital trends DT daily thanks everybody for tuning in I'm Gregg nibbler once again we're live across all of our different platforms right now working on bringing in our next guest Charles J Simon but before we get to that I want to welcome drew PRNDL back to the show hello drew so there were some comments earlier just about your video for the boring flamethrower that went on there they said it looked like a an early P Diddy video that's what I thought I think it was supposed to be a they were supposed to rip on you but I think it was I think it was actually great oh man yeah he did his early stuff was exactly right like oh man yeah thank you whoever said that so drew is also the editor of our emerging tech category here on Digital Trends and so we are working right now on getting our interview on but just to talk about that actually uh so our Charles J Simon who actually wrote the book will computers revolt which is what the book is that I have right here and so I believe that looks like that we we have him on so let's go ahead and bring Charles on there's a great new piece at Digital Trends calm about this you can see it in the background Charles let's go ahead and bring you on can you hear me right now Oh looks like we can't quite hear you so again we're live right now this is live streaming so for everybody who's watching you know as we work through some of this and let's see and I believe Charles is actually out I believe he's on a ship yeah out at sea reading looks like we're still working on some of the audio right there so I'll let our tech staffing behind the scenes here is kind of working on that to get that dub in though let me know when that's when it's all working but yeah so so Charles is for like his record of what he's done is just phenomenal yeah yeah you know everything that he's been involved with and this book I think it's really fascinating now you've actually read through yeah I didn't make it through the entire thing but I did my best to make it through it and it's a it's pretty good it kind of seeks to answer a question that I think every pops into everybody's minds when you're talking about you know AI it's like you know I think everybody kind of accepts the fact that you know AI is going to be a thing we're eventually going to reach the point where computers are as intelligent as humans yeah every aspect whether that be just like factual knowledge or you know creative abilities or even emotional intelligence so it's you kind of accept the fact that that's going to happen sometime in the future right so much a question of if it is when but the question that comes after that is like what happens then like our computer is gonna be evil are they going to revolt against that's the creator's like how to write hair for the future and that's kind of what he seeks to answer in this book and I think that's an important question to think about because like you said it's gonna happen yeah like this is happening I mean we see it every day just with I mean just how fast it happens even when we talk about you know like smart home hubs or or smart assistants yeah you know Google's already got one that can mimic the human voice like mimic speech patterns to where you can almost not even tell the difference so and that's just just the beginning of all of this that's really what he uses to kind of set up the beginning of the book it kind of makes the point that you know obviously this guy doesn't have a crystal ball he doesn't know the future doesn't know exactly when it's gonna happen but he makes a very compelling point about you know it's probably happening sooner than we think yeah AAG I artificial general intelligence where you know computers are just as smart as humans in every aspect a little bit of audio going so we're working here on getting the getting the audio in and and talking about that Rane says look at the games on YouTube look at the game Detroit becomes human which I'm actually play part of that you're right yeah it's just about AI about how much it's you know interacting with everybody here so I'm getting my audio adjusted myself and this is part of you know the live show here at DT daily working on the tech on getting everybody dialed in from wherever and I know Charles is on a boat and you can't see it right now we can see him and I think he can hear us but we can't hear him yo we can yeah yeah actually Charles are you actually a robot this is what we need to know so the the audio so Charles I'm just gonna let you know since we're live so your audio is is it's not working very well it does it it's a what would be the regular bold garbled yeah garbled would be the right right word for it as we're talking about this so I think maybe we'll work on that maybe if behind the scenes could let me know if we'll try to get that dialed in or okay I think I think we'll work on that and see if we can get that get that worked out to get you joined in here but but still talking about your about your book so for anybody doesn't know Charles is literally on a ship at sea right now so that's where he's at so that's what trying to trying to get that elbow see that's the tricky technical part right now but let's walk through just a couple of things with the book too so that way if we do get him dialed in here we can we can talk about this and so one of the main things in the book and again it's will computers revolt and the articles at Digital Trends calm is talking about the term AGI so what is the term AGI mean AGI is artificial general intelligence that's as I was saying earlier the point when computers are just as smart is yeah in every aspect and that is kind of a way for us to differentiate true AI from other forms of AI like yes I right now but what like in the context of like AGI what we have right now is what's referred to as artificial narrow intelligence so we have things that are smarter than humans but only in very specific things yeah like a calculator for example like way better at most people than you know adding subtracting multiplying dividing but it can't make you a cup of coffee or like you know I can't do like so many things that humans can do right right so yeah artificial general intelligence is when it can do everything so that's so that's kind of what he's talking about about where where we're headed here and there's essentially you know and as we're working on getting trials back on again live on DT daily if you have questions Dru's also very familiar with this subject so feel free to drop those in there and we'll well-well talk to my son couple of comments through saying because of the audio issues he sounds like the evil KITT car there Charles and again you know we're we're beaming this in through all who knows what kind of channels to get Charles in here to talk with us right now but Charles does walk through in the book like four different kind of scenarios yeah he makes the argument that you know this is going to happen eventually and yeah we really should start preparing because we don't know how soon this Agia kind of revolution is gonna happen and that's that yes I'm predicting now I mean exponentially increasing exponential yeah advancements and he's got four different scenarios for how this could potentially play out and the first one is the the peaceful coexistence scenario yeah where everything's fine everything's peachy yeah yeah it's basically we develop artificial intelligence and instead of it you know revolting in kind of a negative way and trying to like exterminate the human race like you know movies it's actually something that helps humanity helps us achieve our goals yeah solves all of our problems and we kind of just go into this like utopia that's brought in raptured invite glad to die everything's fine so that's the first like good situation but then it kind of gets bleak from there yeah which is I mean oh let's go ahead and check here just checking our audio do we have Charles Dalian Charles can you hear them here ah you don't sound like an evil KITT car okay what's that's good great so let's go ahead and bring him on right now Charles J Simon author of the book that we're talking about will computers revolt so Charles where are you at right now I'm in Annapolis Maryland out at sea in the in the Chesapeake Bay hey you guys have been I could always hear you so you've done a great job of explaining the book well I've been on well that's that's great well it's so good to have you on you know and this is a subject I'm actually really interested in I I love learning about AI and just just the possibilities and where things are going I know drew is too let's talk about your book so what what was the impetus what made you want to write this book will computers revolt well I've been looking at this for many many years I I started writing the book in 1980 and withdrew it and why did it and you know I've always thought it seems obvious to me that computers will eventually exceed humans and intelligence and I just wanted to explore those wares yeah and where it's going to go and you know we talked about it earlier we brought up AGI artificial general intelligence and we're starting to go into kind of the four different scenarios that you see happening I asked maybe before we even get to that just to ask you do you think robots are going to revolt I don't but this is kind of the warning right here I would imagine so so let's walk through these four different things that we started talking about but let's let's just go from the beginning you're for differ scenarios the ways that you think this could go down with the exponential advancement of artificial intelligence exactly well scenario one call the peaceful coexistence scenario and of course you have to keep in mind that once you have a computer that is as smart as a person in not very many years subsequently you'll have a computer that's 10 times as smart or a hundred times as smart or a thousand or a million times as smart and this is really inconceivable so what happens is that as computers can proceed you simply end up with a situation where computers and humans are now able to speak at the same rate that computers are so much more advanced and so much faster than humans that we might be as interesting to them as a tree and so there's only a kind of a short time where computers and humans are working at the same speed and at that point we have a lot of interaction and we may come into some some areas of dispute and so that's the that's the point at which we have to be a little more careful where they're yeah they're starting to catch up so just that just even though the interaction is going to be something where it may be indistinguishable for us as far as whether somebody is a human or an AI exactly you know one of the things that I'd be and this certainly applies to things like robocall maybe we should announce ourselves as being human or underlay announce ourselves as being not human I am human let's walk on to the next the next subject or so so there's that's one scenario what's the next scenario okay well then we've got the man-machine scenario and the which sounds horrible possibility well yeah when when we develop machines we have to remember that they are rule-based yeah and and thinking of Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics where you create the rules you create the entire behavior of the system and so when you think about creating rules the way humans are we have a set of rules that we call instincts and we've evolved those over millions of years and they are designed for us to be able to survive in the wild and take advantage of things and so we've become territorial and possessive and angry and things like that and computers will live on a different set of rules because that's what will program and there's no redress to program rules that are similar so the computer is likely to be a lot more pacifist then than your average human simply because there's no need for us to program them be aggressive yes there's no need to program jealousy or any of those you know kind of human emotions in there and so when we go through a scenario there the possibility exists of course that you either get a program somebody that's that's gotten misprogrammed or something like that but in general the rule based computer system is not going to be developed to be like a human in terms of having those kinds of interests I mean it makes sense it's kind of like the debate right now talking about even for AI that controls your audio oh you asked okay well I'll tie talking to drew while we're working on getting you dialed in so that kind of reminds me of you know talking about the AI that controls cars like at what point is it we're gonna have to have it make a decision to save you there's the whole bust busload of children yeah or saving yourself from driving off a cliff like how do you totally tell the car what to do yeah you know and you know that's a tricky question it is because we have to we have to program that in the thing is we have full control over that process though so it's really but it's who is it control um yeah yeah that's that's the crux of this is like you know who what if it gets into the hands of the wrong person who uses this the wrong way I suppose yeah yeah as for like personal gain to kind of like dominate the world that's the which isn't something entirely possible you know that means actually I mean you see a lot of like AI and the technology it's you know a lot of the most powerful ones and you know the biggest datasets that are being collected and turned into these AI machines are owned by big corporations right now yeah so I mean it doesn't inspire a lot of faith no I mean it's you start thinking about all the movies where you know a movie scenario where it's they're controlling all of the AI which is pretty much the premise of a lot of movies that are coming out right now we'll still wait here to see if Charles can hear us Charles when you do hear us if you can hear us okay I can't hear us keys please keep your comments and questions coming through here right now I think basically what's happening is the robots want to keep us from talking about this which is why obviously we need to to continue on and do our best alright looks like looks like we're having some issues with it but I want to encourage everybody to go and check out Charles interview or his article at Digital Trends comm and get his book you know take a look at this book will computers revolt I think it's fascinating and it really is something that quite honestly we all have to think about I mean it's it's gonna be it's gonna be occurring and so it's probably gonna be one of these four different scenarios we only got through a couple of them but there's two more they aren't as good but there's some other possibilities that could happen so yeah I want to say a big thank you to Charles for joining us and I think what we're gonna do here is you know that the text not gonna last right now to bring him back on but like I said check out that articleback here with digital trends DT daily thanks everybody for tuning in I'm Gregg nibbler once again we're live across all of our different platforms right now working on bringing in our next guest Charles J Simon but before we get to that I want to welcome drew PRNDL back to the show hello drew so there were some comments earlier just about your video for the boring flamethrower that went on there they said it looked like a an early P Diddy video that's what I thought I think it was supposed to be a they were supposed to rip on you but I think it was I think it was actually great oh man yeah he did his early stuff was exactly right like oh man yeah thank you whoever said that so drew is also the editor of our emerging tech category here on Digital Trends and so we are working right now on getting our interview on but just to talk about that actually uh so our Charles J Simon who actually wrote the book will computers revolt which is what the book is that I have right here and so I believe that looks like that we we have him on so let's go ahead and bring Charles on there's a great new piece at Digital Trends calm about this you can see it in the background Charles let's go ahead and bring you on can you hear me right now Oh looks like we can't quite hear you so again we're live right now this is live streaming so for everybody who's watching you know as we work through some of this and let's see and I believe Charles is actually out I believe he's on a ship yeah out at sea reading looks like we're still working on some of the audio right there so I'll let our tech staffing behind the scenes here is kind of working on that to get that dub in though let me know when that's when it's all working but yeah so so Charles is for like his record of what he's done is just phenomenal yeah yeah you know everything that he's been involved with and this book I think it's really fascinating now you've actually read through yeah I didn't make it through the entire thing but I did my best to make it through it and it's a it's pretty good it kind of seeks to answer a question that I think every pops into everybody's minds when you're talking about you know AI it's like you know I think everybody kind of accepts the fact that you know AI is going to be a thing we're eventually going to reach the point where computers are as intelligent as humans yeah every aspect whether that be just like factual knowledge or you know creative abilities or even emotional intelligence so it's you kind of accept the fact that that's going to happen sometime in the future right so much a question of if it is when but the question that comes after that is like what happens then like our computer is gonna be evil are they going to revolt against that's the creator's like how to write hair for the future and that's kind of what he seeks to answer in this book and I think that's an important question to think about because like you said it's gonna happen yeah like this is happening I mean we see it every day just with I mean just how fast it happens even when we talk about you know like smart home hubs or or smart assistants yeah you know Google's already got one that can mimic the human voice like mimic speech patterns to where you can almost not even tell the difference so and that's just just the beginning of all of this that's really what he uses to kind of set up the beginning of the book it kind of makes the point that you know obviously this guy doesn't have a crystal ball he doesn't know the future doesn't know exactly when it's gonna happen but he makes a very compelling point about you know it's probably happening sooner than we think yeah AAG I artificial general intelligence where you know computers are just as smart as humans in every aspect a little bit of audio going so we're working here on getting the getting the audio in and and talking about that Rane says look at the games on YouTube look at the game Detroit becomes human which I'm actually play part of that you're right yeah it's just about AI about how much it's you know interacting with everybody here so I'm getting my audio adjusted myself and this is part of you know the live show here at DT daily working on the tech on getting everybody dialed in from wherever and I know Charles is on a boat and you can't see it right now we can see him and I think he can hear us but we can't hear him yo we can yeah yeah actually Charles are you actually a robot this is what we need to know so the the audio so Charles I'm just gonna let you know since we're live so your audio is is it's not working very well it does it it's a what would be the regular bold garbled yeah garbled would be the right right word for it as we're talking about this so I think maybe we'll work on that maybe if behind the scenes could let me know if we'll try to get that dialed in or okay I think I think we'll work on that and see if we can get that get that worked out to get you joined in here but but still talking about your about your book so for anybody doesn't know Charles is literally on a ship at sea right now so that's where he's at so that's what trying to trying to get that elbow see that's the tricky technical part right now but let's walk through just a couple of things with the book too so that way if we do get him dialed in here we can we can talk about this and so one of the main things in the book and again it's will computers revolt and the articles at Digital Trends calm is talking about the term AGI so what is the term AGI mean AGI is artificial general intelligence that's as I was saying earlier the point when computers are just as smart is yeah in every aspect and that is kind of a way for us to differentiate true AI from other forms of AI like yes I right now but what like in the context of like AGI what we have right now is what's referred to as artificial narrow intelligence so we have things that are smarter than humans but only in very specific things yeah like a calculator for example like way better at most people than you know adding subtracting multiplying dividing but it can't make you a cup of coffee or like you know I can't do like so many things that humans can do right right so yeah artificial general intelligence is when it can do everything so that's so that's kind of what he's talking about about where where we're headed here and there's essentially you know and as we're working on getting trials back on again live on DT daily if you have questions Dru's also very familiar with this subject so feel free to drop those in there and we'll well-well talk to my son couple of comments through saying because of the audio issues he sounds like the evil KITT car there Charles and again you know we're we're beaming this in through all who knows what kind of channels to get Charles in here to talk with us right now but Charles does walk through in the book like four different kind of scenarios yeah he makes the argument that you know this is going to happen eventually and yeah we really should start preparing because we don't know how soon this Agia kind of revolution is gonna happen and that's that yes I'm predicting now I mean exponentially increasing exponential yeah advancements and he's got four different scenarios for how this could potentially play out and the first one is the the peaceful coexistence scenario yeah where everything's fine everything's peachy yeah yeah it's basically we develop artificial intelligence and instead of it you know revolting in kind of a negative way and trying to like exterminate the human race like you know movies it's actually something that helps humanity helps us achieve our goals yeah solves all of our problems and we kind of just go into this like utopia that's brought in raptured invite glad to die everything's fine so that's the first like good situation but then it kind of gets bleak from there yeah which is I mean oh let's go ahead and check here just checking our audio do we have Charles Dalian Charles can you hear them here ah you don't sound like an evil KITT car okay what's that's good great so let's go ahead and bring him on right now Charles J Simon author of the book that we're talking about will computers revolt so Charles where are you at right now I'm in Annapolis Maryland out at sea in the in the Chesapeake Bay hey you guys have been I could always hear you so you've done a great job of explaining the book well I've been on well that's that's great well it's so good to have you on you know and this is a subject I'm actually really interested in I I love learning about AI and just just the possibilities and where things are going I know drew is too let's talk about your book so what what was the impetus what made you want to write this book will computers revolt well I've been looking at this for many many years I I started writing the book in 1980 and withdrew it and why did it and you know I've always thought it seems obvious to me that computers will eventually exceed humans and intelligence and I just wanted to explore those wares yeah and where it's going to go and you know we talked about it earlier we brought up AGI artificial general intelligence and we're starting to go into kind of the four different scenarios that you see happening I asked maybe before we even get to that just to ask you do you think robots are going to revolt I don't but this is kind of the warning right here I would imagine so so let's walk through these four different things that we started talking about but let's let's just go from the beginning you're for differ scenarios the ways that you think this could go down with the exponential advancement of artificial intelligence exactly well scenario one call the peaceful coexistence scenario and of course you have to keep in mind that once you have a computer that is as smart as a person in not very many years subsequently you'll have a computer that's 10 times as smart or a hundred times as smart or a thousand or a million times as smart and this is really inconceivable so what happens is that as computers can proceed you simply end up with a situation where computers and humans are now able to speak at the same rate that computers are so much more advanced and so much faster than humans that we might be as interesting to them as a tree and so there's only a kind of a short time where computers and humans are working at the same speed and at that point we have a lot of interaction and we may come into some some areas of dispute and so that's the that's the point at which we have to be a little more careful where they're yeah they're starting to catch up so just that just even though the interaction is going to be something where it may be indistinguishable for us as far as whether somebody is a human or an AI exactly you know one of the things that I'd be and this certainly applies to things like robocall maybe we should announce ourselves as being human or underlay announce ourselves as being not human I am human let's walk on to the next the next subject or so so there's that's one scenario what's the next scenario okay well then we've got the man-machine scenario and the which sounds horrible possibility well yeah when when we develop machines we have to remember that they are rule-based yeah and and thinking of Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics where you create the rules you create the entire behavior of the system and so when you think about creating rules the way humans are we have a set of rules that we call instincts and we've evolved those over millions of years and they are designed for us to be able to survive in the wild and take advantage of things and so we've become territorial and possessive and angry and things like that and computers will live on a different set of rules because that's what will program and there's no redress to program rules that are similar so the computer is likely to be a lot more pacifist then than your average human simply because there's no need for us to program them be aggressive yes there's no need to program jealousy or any of those you know kind of human emotions in there and so when we go through a scenario there the possibility exists of course that you either get a program somebody that's that's gotten misprogrammed or something like that but in general the rule based computer system is not going to be developed to be like a human in terms of having those kinds of interests I mean it makes sense it's kind of like the debate right now talking about even for AI that controls your audio oh you asked okay well I'll tie talking to drew while we're working on getting you dialed in so that kind of reminds me of you know talking about the AI that controls cars like at what point is it we're gonna have to have it make a decision to save you there's the whole bust busload of children yeah or saving yourself from driving off a cliff like how do you totally tell the car what to do yeah you know and you know that's a tricky question it is because we have to we have to program that in the thing is we have full control over that process though so it's really but it's who is it control um yeah yeah that's that's the crux of this is like you know who what if it gets into the hands of the wrong person who uses this the wrong way I suppose yeah yeah as for like personal gain to kind of like dominate the world that's the which isn't something entirely possible you know that means actually I mean you see a lot of like AI and the technology it's you know a lot of the most powerful ones and you know the biggest datasets that are being collected and turned into these AI machines are owned by big corporations right now yeah so I mean it doesn't inspire a lot of faith no I mean it's you start thinking about all the movies where you know a movie scenario where it's they're controlling all of the AI which is pretty much the premise of a lot of movies that are coming out right now we'll still wait here to see if Charles can hear us Charles when you do hear us if you can hear us okay I can't hear us keys please keep your comments and questions coming through here right now I think basically what's happening is the robots want to keep us from talking about this which is why obviously we need to to continue on and do our best alright looks like looks like we're having some issues with it but I want to encourage everybody to go and check out Charles interview or his article at Digital Trends comm and get his book you know take a look at this book will computers revolt I think it's fascinating and it really is something that quite honestly we all have to think about I mean it's it's gonna be it's gonna be occurring and so it's probably gonna be one of these four different scenarios we only got through a couple of them but there's two more they aren't as good but there's some other possibilities that could happen so yeah I want to say a big thank you to Charles for joining us and I think what we're gonna do here is you know that the text not gonna last right now to bring him back on but like I said check out that article\n"