"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enHi, Talking Cars fans.We'll be shooting anepisode of the podcastlive at the 2019 LA AutoShow on Friday, November22, between 10:00 AM andnoon and we would loveto have you in our audience.To join us, emailTalkingCars@consumer.orgby Friday, November15, and let usknow if you'd like to attend.You'll be able to askquestions of our expertsand as a special benefit,you'll receive free admissionto the LA Auto Show.All you have to do is getyourself to the Los AngelesConvention Center.Tickets are first come, firstserved, so email us today.We'd love to see you there.We rented a Bentley Bentaygaand BMW M850i convertible.We give our impressions of thesesuper rare and super expensivecars.We talk about the potentialmerger of Peugeot and FiatChrysler and what itmeans to consumers.We answer audience questionsnext on Talking Cars.Hi and welcome back.I'm Mike Quincy.I'm Jake Fisher.And I'm Keith Barry.So one of the news stories thatwe've been following this weekis a potential merger betweenFrench automaker Peugeotand Fiat Chrysler, oftenreferred to as FCA.According to the NewYork Times, combinedthese two companies sell 8.7million vehicles per year,making the new companyslightly bigger than GM,trailing only Volkswagen,Toyota, and the Renault-NissanAlliance in terms ofvehicle production.So--That's--Yeah, that's-- it can bereally big news and honestly,for all things French, weturn to Keith Barry who isour resident French car expertin case you didn't know thatactually existed.I'm not tremendouslyexcited about this.This is a business deal.This does not mean thatwe're going to be--so Peugeot PSA is the parentcompany, Peugeot and Citroen--and it doesn't meanthat we're goingto be seeing a Citroen Cactus,which is the C3 was actuallyjust discontinued.The Citroen Cactus--I--I-- rented--You're not going to be seeing--with the air bumps on the side?Yes.I rented one--Aren't they cool?When I was in Italy.It's gone.Yeah.Aww.It's gone.Yeah.This is the nationalcar of Arizona, I mean.But no matter what,we're not goingto be seeing this sortof current generationof cool French carsin the United States.That's just not going to happen.We know this because a lot of ustalk to some industry analystsand, basically, whatanalysts are sayingis that this gives anopportunity for twocar companies to strengthentheir position aheadof some turbulenttimes for automakers.Electrification, you know,emissions regulation,a potential economic downturn.That, basically,these two companiesare trying to work witheach other's strengthsto make a stronger companythat can weather that.To plan for the future.To plan for the future.So the cars today--you know, Peugeothas already said,I mean, they'vebeen saying forthe past 30 years,but that they want to comeback to the United States.But they actually havea US headquarters.It's apparently insideof a WeWork in Atlanta.So, you know, it's not exactly.But they brought-- theybrought a Peugeot 508to the United States.Some of our colleagueshave seen it driving aroundin manufacturer plates.They're trying to figureout the US market.The other thing is thatthese two companies dodifferent things differently.Peugeot does a reallygood job at small cars.I drove a 308 a few years back.Absolutely loved it.You thought I was kiddingabout the whole French car.No.I go to the--I go to the rental deskswhen I'm in Europe and say,I want something Frenchand they say why?Give you croissants.Especially in Germany.And they say, really?But anyhow.But FCA has Jeep.FCA has those SUV platforms.PSA doesn'tnecessarily have those.They borrow somefrom Mitsubishi,which is weird because they'rein a different alliance now.The PSA also has Opel ,which used to be part of GM.Right.And so all of these, theysort of complement each other.And I think going forward we'llsee some product planning.But right now, we'renot going to be getting,you know, a Citroen DS fromthe past or your family'sold Peugeot, right?You had one, right?Yeah.Yeah.When I was a little kid.My parents had a '73 504.You know, but--Was it diesel?Well, we actuallygot rid of thatand we got a '79that was diesel.Both of those are stilltaxis somewhere in the world.They were.Yes.You know, look, I mean, Peugeothas been away for so longthat they've kind of gonethrough all different trialsand tribulations and they'vechanged what they were.I mean, those Peugeots inthe '70s were very luxuriousand they rode nice and then.I mean, the truth isis that I wouldn'tsay the Peugeot is definitelylike top level car companyright now.So I mean, here's the issue,is that we kind of seenthis with FCA before.So the whole thing--let's-- let's talk,call it what it is.It's about platform sharing.OK?That's what we're talking about.And we've seen this with Fiat.So I mean, you look at--look at Chrysler,look at Dodge, right?I mean a lot of Dodgesgoing around stillhave Mercedes Benzunderpinnings--Right.Because--They're in transmission.Well, I mean, like you know,Dodge Challenger, Charger.And that kind of has some ofthe guts of a Mercedes Benz eclass.And then we had theDodge Dart which hadthe underpinnings of a Fiat.And so there's a lotof platform sharing.What this is going to mean--Jeep Renegade, Fiat 500x.But-- but these other--Yeah.But the Jeep Renegade, that'sstill kind of like a Fiat.Yeah.But they really didn'twork because, I mean,Fiats haven't sold that well.And they're--Well, the issue is--And they're cancellingthe 500 for 2020.The issue is--well, from the viewof what we see peoplereally interested in cars,they want carsthat are reliable,that are going towork for a long time.I don't know if Peugeotis necessarily the onethat they need that for.So, I mean, mergers are nothingnew in the auto industry.And Peugeot's talkingabout maybe noteven going to be back inthe US market until 2026.So in terms of the consumer andwhat they can expect to see, ,I mean we don't have any insightinto their product planning,I guess, I mean.Well, yeah.And what changed?I think what youexpect to see issome of the nextgenerations we'regoing to see fromChrysler, and Dodge,or whatever, you're goingto have shared componentsthat are going to be global.Right.We've seen thisbefore with Fiat.This doesn't necessarilymake them better.But, you know what?There are certaineconomies of scaleand maybe they couldpass the savings onto us.We can only hope.And as we know more,we'll tell you more.Which brings us to whatwe're driving this week.And in some ways, it's kind oflike the fantasy garage week.Someone's fantasy.Exactly.That's a good way of putting it.So what we did iswe rented some--two very high end,very obscure cars.I'm going to try to getthe pronunciation right.A Bentley Bentayga SUV, as wellas a BMW M850i convertible.Now combined, these two vehicleshave over 1,000 horsepowerand cost over $340,000.Now, why, Jake--Yes.Are we renting these cars?Why, why, why, why.Why do we rent cars ingeneral from other automakers?All right.So let's get down tothe business here.I mean, when we test cars, wetest cars that we purchase.We purchase 50 cars,about 50 cars every year,and we are only testing those.We do not gethandouts from the car.So if we were maybe some othercar magazine or somethinglike that, not only wouldbe driving these cars,we would be on, like, their dimegoing to the south of Francedriving them around.Or they drop it off atyour house for a weekand you have it.And you know that if yousay something bad about it,you might not haveanother one again.So we do have theability to say somethingbad, if warranted, orsomething good, if warranted.But so when it comesdown to these vehicles,I mean, we're talking aboutvehicles that are around 100,you know, $100,000 or more,it does not make sense.We do-- we're nonprofit here.It does not make sense forus to purchase these vehiclesand do the tests.We're looking formainstream vehicles.These are notmainstream vehicles.They sell like, maybe,below 1,000 in a year.But what's interestingis that someof these vehicles,including Bentleyshave shown up onsome of our surveys.So people do own these vehicles.We do sometimes getdata on these vehiclesin terms of satisfactionand reliability.And there is aneed to say, well,it's a little bit about the car.So in these cases, wewill go and get the carsfrom manufacturers.We pay for the use of them, sowe're not taking the handouts.But we will create some contentand we can talk about them.We're not, again, not puttingthem through the tests.We're not going to betaking data off these.And quite often whenwe rent vehicles,we're looking for-- sometimesthey have new cutting edgetechnology--Well, they used to, at least.Right.So does it-- do you thinkwe found anything in this,either the Bentley or the 850i?Well, I've got the keys.They're ridiculously large keys.That's it.You're driving for lunch today.For--Look at those keys.For both of these.Totally worth it.I have thoughts and feelings.So I think, I mean, this is--Next on Oprah.These thoughts and feelings.This-- this-- Oprah's beenoff the air for like--all right.Next on Regis and Kathie Lee.We got, the Bentley'swheels alone are $16,000.This is a car that costsmore than a lot of houses.The wheels aren't $16,000.Oh, yeah.The wheels are $16,000.The wheels are $16,000.The wheels aren't $16,000.It comes with apackage that costs--first of all, $16,000for any package is crazy.Right.And so it comes withthis-- what is it called?I got notes here.Dave will be happy.It's the Molinardriving specification.Dave won't be happy cause I'mprobably pronouncing it wrong.But that does cost 16,000,which comes with 22 inch wheels,but it also comes with areally nice interior stuff.The interior is incredible.And I assume becauseyou're payingthe $16,000, if you didn't getthat, it would be like, what?Vinyl, you know, youkind of hose it off.It would be like--Sure.Right.Yeah.Let me start with a good point.Is that I think thatit's very cool, to me,that-- and I think that a2,000-- $200,000 SUV basedon an Audi platform is obscene.I mean, I think that this is--I think it shouldbring you coffeein the morning forthat much money.They send a Volkswagen group.So the Lamborghini is a severalhundred thousand dollarsplatform sharing.But there is somethingto be said hereabout culture heritage.I do think thathaving these blokesin the Midlands in England,who for three generationshave been polishingwood and doingthis leather and thisupholstery and this hand built,coach built idea.I think it's a goodthing that that exists.Charming.It is charming.It's like a vacationin the Cotswolds.I couldn't afford a house there.But I'm glad they exist.But I'm glad that, say, theBentley Mulsanne exists.That is a Sedan that coststwice as much as this SUV,often depending upon how it's--but it has the Bentley6 and 3/4 liter V8.It's on its own platform.It's its own sort of--a Bentley needs toexist in the world.It just has toexist, and it shouldbe a big, beautifulsedan: that's powerfuland somewhat understated.This is vulgar.I mean, if you'respending $220,000,$216,000, go out and get a Q8.This is the last time we'regoing to get a Bentley.$220,000, there's noadaptive cruise control?Oh, hold on.Let's talk aboutthe car before wepsychoanalyze the driversand the people whoput this for sale.But that's why these cars exist.But let's talk--this is car show.OK, we stick to cars.We've driven these cars.Yes, how did they drive?We could have had the speechwithout driving the cars.How do they drive?So let's talk about the Bentley.So the Bentley is theone that we drove.It's $215,000 for afive passenger SUV.It smells incredible.So no, seriously.It's like being inside likean Italian handbag, I assume,because it's like there'sjust leather everywhere.Everything is all stitch.And that's I thinkpart of that $16,000package, which you getleather all the things.You are a wealthyperson's small dog.It's trying to remindyou how wealthy you are.So in terms of driving,look, it's fast.It's got a lot of power.I will say this weekend I droveour BMW X7, which is also quickand, I would say, drives better.It's a little lighter, probably.The steering is a little better.It rides a little better.It's a little bit quieter.But again, I mean, again,not to psychoanalyze,but it's a little bit of,oh, but it's a Bentley.So there's a lotof that going on.But here's the thing.It's like, what do you get.And this is part of thereason that we're actuallydriving these things.What do you actually get?Is it all that?It's not all that.Yeah, it used to be atthe extreme high end.You would get, say, thenew S-Class would come outand it would debut DISTRONIC.You would have new technology--So the bones werereally special.I mean, like the S-Class,I mean, we did test--I mean, one of the firsttimes we tested an S-Class,it's like, oh my god,this thing rides amazing.And it's so quiet.And now they're taking somethingthat exists and gussying it up.But the thing is, like, you canget a mainstream vehicle thatrides and handles really,really well this thing.But it's like, yes, it'sgot leather everything.But going back to theACC, what we drovedid not have adaptivecruise control.And you're like, is thatstandard these days.Well, it's not.But I got reallyinto some of this--so by the way, thecar starts at $165,000and then our carhad nearly $50,000worth of options on top of that.And a lot of theseare made bespoke.You call up.You order it.I mean, the color, theinterior of this thing isa cricket ball.Yes, that's the secondary hide.Anyway, so-- I'mgoing to move on.It's OK, because we've gotto get to the 8-50, too.But what I want to make a pointof is that, even at $200,000,it does not havestandard AEB, does nothave Standard AutomaticEmergency Braking.The Nissan Versa has standardautomatic emergency breaking.The Toyota Corolla.No, our car does have--About a 20th.Our car, this one, did have acity speed automatic emergencybraking, but itwas a $4,000 optionon top of all that other stuff.I suppose, if you buy aBentley, you're just notas concerned about this.But again, we'reConsumer Reports.So we're looking at what areyou getting for your money.And it's pretty clear that,well, some substance but notas much as you would getfor cars costing much less.I'm getting hot on the collar.Can we talk aboutthe M8 now, the M850?Let's go for the M850convertible, 523 horsepower.Honestly, one of the bestthings about this caris the power train.It just seems like ithas unlimited power,incredible acceleration,great exhaust note.What did you guys--I drove it all weekend.So I'm like, oh, OK,but what did you think.Again, it's hard toget over the price.I mean, it drives very nice.It's a big car.The engine sounds incredible.It's got the buttonsyou could press.Sport mode.sport plus,and then it's startsbackfiring and sounds all cool.So if you're notobnoxious enough,you could kind oftell everybody.I did the remote startfrom outside the carjust so I could hear the burble.You can hear the engine burble.I will say, though, I mean,in test we have the SUPRA.And it also has a button on it.And it also makes that blatblat sound for a lot less money.But maybe it's not my thing.But I mean, look, you geta nice warm summer night.You cruise around on it.Sounds great.It's got the littlewarmers on the headrest.It's the neck scarf thing.Neck scarf stuff.I mean, it's aclassic grand tour.I mean, and the handling,it felt so big and planted.It felt like, when youwere going into a cornerand you turn the wheel alittle, the car didn't movebut the earth moves around you.It was incredible.That's a good visualization.I like that.I mean, for me, I think thatthat's a much better valuefor your money.If I had $216,000to buy and I wanteda giant SUV and a fast car,I'd buy an X7 and an M850iand it would still cost abouttheWell, see, actually, I wasthinking about that scenariotoo.Honestly, I would be--I wouldn't buy eitherof those, but--Even if I can affordthese two crazy cars,I would be much happier witha Telluride and a BullittMustang.That's what I would get.I was going rightdown the path of you--Telluride, andI'll take a Miata,by the way, which is way less.But I think whatreally stands outfor me is not such likethe emperor doesn'thave all the clothes.It's more about how goodother cars have got.It's not so muchlike, wow, it's good.But it's like, youget to a Tellurideor you get some ofthese others and it'slike, they're really good too.You don't have to spend sixfigures to get a really, reallywell driving car.Speaking of borrowedcars or rented cars,we did rent a hightrim version of--what was it-- the Palisade.Yeah, so we had a high trim--It has quilted leather.It didn't come from 12 cowhides,but it had quilted leather.It was gorgeousinside, absolutely.It was.Well, listen, that wasreally the fantasy garageprobably of all time forTalking Cars podcast, whichis going to move us onto our next segment here,which is your questions.We love getting them.Text questions, video questionsTalkingCars@icloud.com.Please keep them coming.So first up is a videoquestion from Tim.And he's got a questionabout snow tires.Hi, Consumer Reports.I live about 15miles from Chicago.We get about 28 days offresh snow each winter.So assuming we haveroughly 100 days of wintereach year, that's 28 dayswhere winter tires wouldbe a big advantage.Consumer Reports reviewsshow that winter tireshave longer stoppingdistances on wet or drypavement than all season tires.So aren't I sacrificing mystopping distance about 70%of the winter for winter tiretraction on only 28 days outof the year?Thanks.I'll hang up andlisten for my answer.All right, snow tires, Chicago--Keith, what do you got for Tim?So I did a littleresearch and foundthat it's sort of anissue of proportionality.Yes, snow tires don't haveas-- or I will call themwinter tires, becausethe benefit of snow tiresisn't just tractionin snow and ice.It's also the compound ofthe rubber actually makesfor better adhesionin cold temperatures,like the freezingcold temperaturesyou get in Chicago.With that said, dependingupon the tire that you buy,we found on average thedifference in wet brakingis about a car length goingfrom 60 miles an hour to zero.So that is someone is in frontof you on Lakeshore Drive,you slam on your brakes,and you either hit themor don't hit them.Now granted, a car length,you can mitigate thatby driving a littlebit more slowly,by not tailgating as much.At the same time, thebenefit of having snow tires,winter tires is, I wouldsay, proportionally greaterthan the fact that sometimesyour wet braking won'tbe as good.And that's becausethey have bettertraction in the ice onthe snow in the slush.It isn't just about stopping.It's also about thathandling as welland stopping inthe snow and ice.It's really aboutthe ..So it's true.Yes, it's a little bitlonger on those things.But depending on the snowthat you're on or the ice,it could be a 100 foot extrathat you're stopping on.It makes a hugedifference in those--Depending upon the tires, too.Well, and I was going toask you-- a car's length,is that alarming oris that about OK?So the point is that youmay be a little bit longer,like a car's lengthin those conditions.But if it's snow, itmight be 10 car lengthsthat the difference is.You mean 10 car lengthswithout snow tires?Right.So you're 10 car lengthsbetter with the snowtires on the snow, butyou're losing one car length.It's about that proportion.So he's got a great point.It's very interestingbecause I alwaysthink about heavy duty trucks.I always think about the2,500 series or whatever.And a lot of peopleare like, hey,it's a little bitbetter when I tow.But if you're onlytowing 10% of the time,it's a lot worse whenyou're not towing.So I mean, it's those kind of--you're weighing those things.But it is a good pointthat it's not just--it's cool temperatures too.And it depends on thetires too, because Ichecked with Ryan Pinlakowski.And he mentioned that somewinter tires are designedfor extreme winter conditionsand they can actuallyhave much worse wet braking.And those would be if youlived in Jackson Hole.But if you live in Chicago, ifyou get a good balanced wintertire, then you're notgoing to have that 10 timesextra stopping distance whenyou hit the brakes in the snowand maybe you justdon't tailgate as muchor you give a littlemore room on rainy daysat the shouldersin March and April,which you shouldbe anyways, yeah.So basically, long storyshort, get winter tires,but check our ratings tosee what the actual brakingdistances are.And as we're goinginto the winter season,certainly in the Northeast--This is timely.Well, Jake's driveway is likea nosebleed to hill, I mean.So we're seeingsome snow coming up,and actually, my son now, he puton snow tires on mom's Prius.So we're practicing--all wheel drive.We're practicing what we preach.That's right.The new all wheel drive Prius.The next question isanother video questionabout automatic emergencybreaking on a Honda CRV.Hi, my name isMichaelI live on Cape Cod.And I love yourshow, been watchingTalking Cars for a long time.I have a question about theautomatic braking on my 2017CRV Touring.I can see a flashing light thatsays, break, break, break, whenI get close to another car.And I can feel myselfslowing down in trafficand even coming to a full stop.But I wonder whetheror not my car reallywould come to a complete stopif there were a car suddenlyin front of me.I've seen some videos thatshow other cars running upto an inflatable car andcoming to a complete stopin some testing.I don't have an inflatable car.So I don't know how to do thatother than run up to a real carand hope for the best.So can you tell me ifthere's any place wherethey list which cars stopand show any videos of themactually stopping?So Jake, automaticemergency breaking,is this really a thing oris it just a smokescreen?Whoa, I wasn't expectingthat way.But look, not impressedwith the question,impressed with thisguy's question.Because I thinkwhat's impressiveis please do nottry this at home.Yes, you don'thave a blow up car.Believe it or not, I havetalked to some peoplethat have tried this.Don't do that.To the specific answer tothe question, does it work?At what speed?Actually, thesesystems are tested.We look at these systems.Insurance Institute ofHighway Safety, IIHS,they also look at these.On the CRV, they did sometests up at 25 miles per hour,where it actuallyavoided the accident.But your mileage may vary.So it all depends onexactly where that car is--The conditions.--other conditions.So I mean, the point aboutautomatic emergency brakingsystems, they tend to help.They will likelylessen the severity.They will slow down the vehicle.When he has the brake, brake,brake, it will hit the brakes.It'll slow down.It may still hit.The point is that youshould drive the carlike it doesn't have it.But if you do haveit, chances areit's going to lessen theseverity of the impact.Think about it in that wayas opposed to like, hey,I don't have to hit the brakes.It'll do it for me.That's not whatit's designed for.And Keith, when welistened to thisand watched this videoquestion, it almostseemed like he was alsotalking about forward collisionwarning.Yeah so Mike in old Cape Codwhere the winding roads seemto beckon you,when he doesn't hitthe brakes on those windingsroads, what he's seeingis forward collision warning.And that is the first line ofdefense that is saying like,you might be lookingat something else.You might not bepaying attention.The sun might be in your eyes.It's a first line ofdefense because you're--It's not designed thatyou're going around a corneror something like that.It's about there's something--There's somethingin front of you.And don't hit it, please.Yes, and if you don'trespond to that, that'swhen the car kind oftakes over and doesthe best it can to stop you.So they're two differentsystems-- the brake, brake,brake.You see that sometimes.I mean, honestly it kind ofworks as the same system.I mean, I knowone'sforward collision warning,one's automatic breaking.But basically, it'sthe same intentionand it's a layered thing.One gets you to stop the car.The other one-- yeah.And they're using thesame sensors and all that.And they're kind ofworking together.And we're going to haveto stop this podcast soonbecause Subarus' DaveAbrams is like, OK,come on, move it along.Anyway, thank you for thoseanswers and a great question.I'm going to hit thebrakes on that, exactly.So we're going to wrap thisup with a question from Georgein Ohio, who's lookingfor a midlife crisis car.George writes, I'm lookingto replace my 2014 VolvoXC60, which has been fraughtwith reliability issues,with what I'm consideringa midlife crisis car.I like to do some moderateoff roading and campingand have fond memories ofdriving my mother's Rubicon.I also like the Ram 1500with its offroad package,which would retainsome creature comforts.I've driven both, but FCA'sreliability and customerservice makes me nervous.Yeah, wait, tillPeugeot gets involved.Is that still true?Any other recommendations?So what do we have for George?Take it away, Jake.So the Ram, I mean, it isa very luxurious vehicle.I mean, it rides nice.It's quiet.I think it's probably nearlyup there with a Bentley.The Bentley pickup trucks.But the truth isis that, yeah, Imean a lot of thebig pickup trucks,the reliabilityis not that great.It's something you'regoing to have to deal with.Unfortunately, if youwant a big off roader,I mean, you couldcertainly go with a Toyota.I mean, that's goingto be more reliable.But it's not nearlyas nice to drive.Tacoma or the Tundra.Especially with the off roadTRD package on the Tundra.It's pretty stiff riding.It's very stiff.So Keith, what'syour recommendation?Yeah, I like the Ram 1500.I like that.And I mean, in terms ofreliability's concerned,if you've dealt withVolvo reliability, I mean,it's like a root canalversus a filling.Well, he's got an older Volvo.Volvo's weren't that badactually in that oldergeneration.So what he's gotis the new Volvo,as we were talking about, arereally having some issues.But he's saying, I didhave issues with mine.Right, right.Statistically.You're not goingto get a trouble--a trouble free fun car is what?A Miata.There are some.It always comes up.Well, what's interestingis that neither you guys--he talked about a pickup truck.He talked about a Jeep Wrangler.Nobody said the Gladiator.Oh, becauseas smart as you are.I don't know.Well, I thought he wasworried about reliability.I mean, I wouldkeep with the Ram.But the only vehicles that hementioned were FCA products.And I know that they're alwayskind of on the edge of sortof reliable, sortof not reliable.But I mean, it's hard to get--Midlife crisis and Wrangler,go together?Yeah, because when youthink midlife crisis,I always think sportscar, but whatever.But you can bring the family in.Exactly.You get more seats.You get more utility.And he likes campingand outdoorsyness.So this may be oneof those situations--so it would the rare adviceto get an extended warranty.Yeah, there you go.Anyway, good choices.This is an interestingmidlife crisis dilemma.I really hadn't thoughtabout a truck or a Jeep.But hey, why not?Whatever works for you.Anyway, that's going todo it for this episode.If you want to learn more aboutthe topics or the vehiclesthat we talked about,check out the show notes.Thanks so much for tuning in.We'll see you next week.\n"