Using Mastic and Pre-Mixed Products in Shower Pans is a Big No-No

When it comes to applying thin set mortar to shower pans, there's one product that should never be used: mastic. Yes, you read that right - never use mastic in a shower pan or shower period. Our personal experience and the TC (Tile Contractor) A Handbook have taught us that using mastic can lead to some serious problems down the line. The reason is simple: when all the trowel ridges are facing the same direction, they will compress and air will be released, leaving you with a weak bond between the tile, thinset, and shower pan.

So what's a better option? Directional troweling, of course! By having the trowel ridges face in different directions, we can create a strong and even bond between the tile and the shower pan. This ensures that the tile is securely attached and will provide you with a 95 to 100% coverage - exactly what you need for a wet area like a shower.

Shower Pan Tiles First or Walls First? It's All About the Expansion and Contraction Joint

When it comes to installing mosaic tiles in a shower pan, there's one critical concept to keep in mind: expansion and contraction joints. These joints are essential to ensure that the tile can move and adjust to changes in temperature and humidity, without compromising its integrity.

So, when should you install the mosaic tiles first or the walls first? Well, for most curbed or curbless showers, we recommend tiling the shower pan first, followed by the walls. Here's why: when you set any type of tile on a shower pan, you need to leave an expansion and contraction joint between the shower pan tile and the wall. This joint should be at least one-eighth of an inch wide, and it's essential that there's nothing set in it - no thinset, no adhesive, just a clean space for the joint to breathe.

By tiling the walls first, you can cover this expansion and contraction joint with the tile itself, creating a seamless and monolithic look. And when you're done setting the tiles, you can apply a flexible silica 100% silicone between the wall tile and the shower pan tile - another critical step in ensuring that your mosaic looks its best.

Choosing the Right Tile Nippers for Penny Mosaics

When it comes to cutting penny mosaics or other delicate tiles, you'll need the right tools for the job. For this project, we used Mont Elite tile nippers, which are some of the most premier tools available for tile work. These nippers are a little more expensive than what you'll find in home stores, but trust us - they're worth every penny.

With these nippers, you can cut even the most intricate designs with ease and precision. We used them to cut half-moon shapes around the shower drain, creating a seamless and professional-looking mosaic that's sure to impress. And remember, when cutting penny mosaics, it's essential to leave a little extra space - about 1/32 of an inch above the shower drain itself.

Tips for Installing Penny Mosaics in Showers

So you've got your tiles, your thinset, and your nippers - now what? Here are a few final tips to keep in mind when installing penny mosaics in showers:

* Make sure to inspect the back of each tile before setting it, to ensure that the mesh isn't covered in glue. This can be a major issue if you don't catch it early.

* Clean the top of the tiles as you set them, using a little paintbrush in between the penny mosaics to remove any excess thinset or debris.

* And finally, take your time and be patient - installing a penny mosaic is all about attention to detail and precision. With these tips and a little practice, you'll be creating stunning shower mosaics like a pro!

"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enin this video we're gonna discuss tips on how to tile a shower pan specifically with a penny tile this so this is a little penny tile it's black and there's a mesh on the back so we're going to go over a lot of really great tips and suggestions that'll make your project so much easier and better and we're going to be following tips from the TCA handbook the tile Council of North America handbook and so most of the time I say most of the time because sometimes we don't use every single tip but those are outliers and in this video we're going to be discussing all the suggestions that the TCA has for you so first and foremost before we even begin with the tile the most important thing is to install the shower pan the right way so in this shower we used looters new shower trade now this is a pre sloped shower tray the only thing that we needed to make sure it was number one that our joists for 16 inches on center and that there was 3/4 inch plywood underneath that plywood was flat in level and we bonded the Schluter shower tray part of the Schlueter handbook so always make sure you follow the directions of the manufacturer that made the shower tray or shower pan if you're building your own obviously try to follow the TCM a handbook but once the shower pan was installed the next step was for us to by the way we actually waterproof the walls but before we put the shower tray but the next step was the flood test everything and make sure it was waterproof the second thing that we did was we chose the right bonding material so in this case we used slitters all set and we mix that again purse looters specifications so the great thing which leaders all set is that's a thin set mortar that thing can be used to bond the shower pan to the plywood it can also be used upon tile to Kirti or deter or whatever so that's the great thing about using Schluter all set when you look at mosaics there's one really specific thing that you need to do it's not necessarily with the top of the tile it's with the back so usually the tiles are bonded to a mesh with some type of adhesive if that adhesive is too thick on the back of the tile the tile is only bonding to that adhesive and not the thinset mortar hopefully that makes sense if you have any questions just let us know in the comments but this is a really nice example of what you want to look for you've got the mesh and you can see the tile through the mesh there isn't really a ton of adhesive bonding the tile to the mesh and that really means that the back of this this mesh and the tile are gonna bond properly to the thinset mortar so make sure you carefully inspect your mosaic before you buy a ton of it another important tip is to choose the right size trowel so this is a 1/4 inch by 1/4 inch square notch trowel and this provided us with the right amount of coverage between our shower pan our pre sloped shower pan in the penny mosaic if you're not sure what size trowel use we recommend that you call the thinset manufacturer and ask them what they recommend based on the thin set that you're using and also the size of the tile also I wanted to mention this this is kind of a bonus tip and that is never I repeat never ever use a mastic or a pre-mixed product in a shower pan or in a shower period never ever use of mastic and that again is per our personal experience and also the TC a TCM a handbook so never ever use mastic inside a shower when applying thin set mortar to the shower pan we use directional traveling and the reason why is when all of the trowel ridges are facing the same direction they will compress and air will be released and you'll be left with a really nice bond between the tile the thinset and the shower pan so use directional trialing for bonding the tile to the shower pan and that'll provide you with a 95 to 100% coverage that you need for a wet area in this case a shower so we always get asked this question should you install the mosaic onto the shower pan first or should you tile the walls first well in this particular instance and for most curbed or curbless showers we like tiling the shower pan first and then the walls so why is that well when you set any type of tile on a shower pan you should leave an expansion and contraction joint between the shower pan tile in the wall and that expansion and contraction is going to be at a minimum one-eighth of an inch and you should do the exact same thing between the mosaic and the curve so along the entire perimeter of the shower inside the shower pan area you've got an expansion and contraction joint that expansion and contraction joints should not have anything set in it and you can cover it using the wall tile so this porcelain tile which you see behind me and also the subway tile one of the other two walls they are thick enough the tiles are thick enough to cover that expansion and contraction joint and then when you're done setting the tile you can actually use a flexible silica 100% silicone between the wall tile and the shower pan tile but we're getting a little bit of ahead of ourselves as you probably know one of the most critical concepts with a mosaic is to make sure that when you set this you can't see the intersection between the different sheets they should all become one cohesive monolithic looking piece of tile in the shower pan so it's very very important that when you set these tiles that you actually bond them such that you can't see the lines between the sheets and that actually happens whenever you first do a dry layout so we like to in a dry layout first then we apply our thin set mortar and then we bond all of our dry laid out mosaic sheets such you can see the lines between them but yet you leave that 1/8 expansion and contraction joint between the walls and the curve so what's one of the best tools to use for a penny mosaic well it's these tile nippers these are Mont elites tile nippers and they're probably one of the most premier tile nippers that you can get for penny mosaic or glass really any type of tile yes they're a little bit more money than what you'll have to spend in a home store but if you're doing any type of serious tile work and you don't want to be frustrated with cutting penny mosaics or other tiles definitely check out Mont elite style dippers this is not a sponsored video or anything we use these for this project and they were phenomenal because we actually had to cut Halfmoon shapes around the shower drain so this is one of those tools that you definitely should check out if you're cutting penny mosaics now here's a hot tip and it is you want your penny mosaics to be slightly higher just slightly higher let's say like 130 1/32 of an inch above the shower drain that way all the water will drain down into the drain and not puddle around the perimeter of it so again that's a hot tip you want your tiles to be just a little bit higher 1/32 the 1/16 of an inch above the shower drain itself this is a no-brainer you should also be cleaning the top of the tiles as you set them and you can use a little paintbrush in between the penny mosaics to clean any of the thinset out from between the penny mosaic tiles mosaic tiles look awesome and curbs or curbless showers but remember the big tip before you start your project is they inspect the back of the tile to make sure the mesh isn't covered in glue so hopefully you like the tips in this video give us a thumbs up if that's the case and if you're installing or building a custom shower definitely check out bathroom repair tutor comm you'll love the videos over there I've no doubt they'll help you out with your project thanks for watching and we'll see in the next tutorial take carein this video we're gonna discuss tips on how to tile a shower pan specifically with a penny tile this so this is a little penny tile it's black and there's a mesh on the back so we're going to go over a lot of really great tips and suggestions that'll make your project so much easier and better and we're going to be following tips from the TCA handbook the tile Council of North America handbook and so most of the time I say most of the time because sometimes we don't use every single tip but those are outliers and in this video we're going to be discussing all the suggestions that the TCA has for you so first and foremost before we even begin with the tile the most important thing is to install the shower pan the right way so in this shower we used looters new shower trade now this is a pre sloped shower tray the only thing that we needed to make sure it was number one that our joists for 16 inches on center and that there was 3/4 inch plywood underneath that plywood was flat in level and we bonded the Schluter shower tray part of the Schlueter handbook so always make sure you follow the directions of the manufacturer that made the shower tray or shower pan if you're building your own obviously try to follow the TCM a handbook but once the shower pan was installed the next step was for us to by the way we actually waterproof the walls but before we put the shower tray but the next step was the flood test everything and make sure it was waterproof the second thing that we did was we chose the right bonding material so in this case we used slitters all set and we mix that again purse looters specifications so the great thing which leaders all set is that's a thin set mortar that thing can be used to bond the shower pan to the plywood it can also be used upon tile to Kirti or deter or whatever so that's the great thing about using Schluter all set when you look at mosaics there's one really specific thing that you need to do it's not necessarily with the top of the tile it's with the back so usually the tiles are bonded to a mesh with some type of adhesive if that adhesive is too thick on the back of the tile the tile is only bonding to that adhesive and not the thinset mortar hopefully that makes sense if you have any questions just let us know in the comments but this is a really nice example of what you want to look for you've got the mesh and you can see the tile through the mesh there isn't really a ton of adhesive bonding the tile to the mesh and that really means that the back of this this mesh and the tile are gonna bond properly to the thinset mortar so make sure you carefully inspect your mosaic before you buy a ton of it another important tip is to choose the right size trowel so this is a 1/4 inch by 1/4 inch square notch trowel and this provided us with the right amount of coverage between our shower pan our pre sloped shower pan in the penny mosaic if you're not sure what size trowel use we recommend that you call the thinset manufacturer and ask them what they recommend based on the thin set that you're using and also the size of the tile also I wanted to mention this this is kind of a bonus tip and that is never I repeat never ever use a mastic or a pre-mixed product in a shower pan or in a shower period never ever use of mastic and that again is per our personal experience and also the TC a TCM a handbook so never ever use mastic inside a shower when applying thin set mortar to the shower pan we use directional traveling and the reason why is when all of the trowel ridges are facing the same direction they will compress and air will be released and you'll be left with a really nice bond between the tile the thinset and the shower pan so use directional trialing for bonding the tile to the shower pan and that'll provide you with a 95 to 100% coverage that you need for a wet area in this case a shower so we always get asked this question should you install the mosaic onto the shower pan first or should you tile the walls first well in this particular instance and for most curbed or curbless showers we like tiling the shower pan first and then the walls so why is that well when you set any type of tile on a shower pan you should leave an expansion and contraction joint between the shower pan tile in the wall and that expansion and contraction is going to be at a minimum one-eighth of an inch and you should do the exact same thing between the mosaic and the curve so along the entire perimeter of the shower inside the shower pan area you've got an expansion and contraction joint that expansion and contraction joints should not have anything set in it and you can cover it using the wall tile so this porcelain tile which you see behind me and also the subway tile one of the other two walls they are thick enough the tiles are thick enough to cover that expansion and contraction joint and then when you're done setting the tile you can actually use a flexible silica 100% silicone between the wall tile and the shower pan tile but we're getting a little bit of ahead of ourselves as you probably know one of the most critical concepts with a mosaic is to make sure that when you set this you can't see the intersection between the different sheets they should all become one cohesive monolithic looking piece of tile in the shower pan so it's very very important that when you set these tiles that you actually bond them such that you can't see the lines between the sheets and that actually happens whenever you first do a dry layout so we like to in a dry layout first then we apply our thin set mortar and then we bond all of our dry laid out mosaic sheets such you can see the lines between them but yet you leave that 1/8 expansion and contraction joint between the walls and the curve so what's one of the best tools to use for a penny mosaic well it's these tile nippers these are Mont elites tile nippers and they're probably one of the most premier tile nippers that you can get for penny mosaic or glass really any type of tile yes they're a little bit more money than what you'll have to spend in a home store but if you're doing any type of serious tile work and you don't want to be frustrated with cutting penny mosaics or other tiles definitely check out Mont elite style dippers this is not a sponsored video or anything we use these for this project and they were phenomenal because we actually had to cut Halfmoon shapes around the shower drain so this is one of those tools that you definitely should check out if you're cutting penny mosaics now here's a hot tip and it is you want your penny mosaics to be slightly higher just slightly higher let's say like 130 1/32 of an inch above the shower drain that way all the water will drain down into the drain and not puddle around the perimeter of it so again that's a hot tip you want your tiles to be just a little bit higher 1/32 the 1/16 of an inch above the shower drain itself this is a no-brainer you should also be cleaning the top of the tiles as you set them and you can use a little paintbrush in between the penny mosaics to clean any of the thinset out from between the penny mosaic tiles mosaic tiles look awesome and curbs or curbless showers but remember the big tip before you start your project is they inspect the back of the tile to make sure the mesh isn't covered in glue so hopefully you like the tips in this video give us a thumbs up if that's the case and if you're installing or building a custom shower definitely check out bathroom repair tutor comm you'll love the videos over there I've no doubt they'll help you out with your project thanks for watching and we'll see in the next tutorial take care\n"