"WEBVTTKind: captionsLanguage: enthis week we give our first impressions of the 2022 mitsubishi outlander discuss rivien's adventure network of electric car chargers aimed at outdoor enthusiasts and will gas powered cars have less resale value in used car market dominated by hybrids all that and more next on talking cars hi and welcome back i'm mike quincy i'm mike monticello and i'm jake fisher so as we do in our talking cars podcast we're always looking at what's going on in automotive news and this week something really jumped out in this and it is involving the rhythian uh startup ev manufacturer rivian makes is it was about to make uh electric uh pickup trucks and suvs they really wowed us all on the automotive circuit a couple years ago when we went to car shows which we deeply miss back in the day but back in the day uh and so their announcement uh is mostly focused on their charging network and it's called the rivian adventure network which sounds like adventure time for those of you who have kids and watch cartoons and according to the company's website uh and i'm quoting them the rivian adventure network is a nationwide network of fast charging sites capable of adding up to 140 miles of range in 20 minutes the rivian adventure network is planned to grow to more than 3 500 fast chargers at over 600 sites by the end of 2023 now uh jake you you brought this to our attention because rivian is is looking at specific locations to kind of build this network in kind of an interesting way sure yeah i mean what's interesting about this is um you know okay the fast dc chargers i mean it sounds a whole lot like tesla i mean tesla did a very similar thing they put in their whole network across the country um but what's kind of interesting what rivien is talking about is not just that adventure network which is you know got a kind of neat name to it but it's also these waypoint chargers that they're also putting in so in addition to those they're putting about 10 000 they're talking about of these waypoint charges now what these are are one there's more of them because they're probably going to be cheaper because they're not fast dc charging they're slower chargers but they're looking to put them kind of in a lot of different places so they're putting it in places like parks they're talking about starting this this summer they're going to put in every state park in colorado is going to have rivien chargers maybe even trail heads i mean certain places that an outdoorsy person would use so it's just kind of an interesting i thought it was interesting was kind of a different thought about this it's we're we're going past like you know the rest stop on the highway and more of like really how you might be using your vehicle all right and mike you had some thoughts about this and what what riven is going to do uh we'll have to see you know where people really are going with their electric vehicles and how important this really is to be able because i'm thinking as a mountain biker i'm thinking you know it could be interesting that when you if i were to drive to a trailhead and plug in my ev and if i'm riding for two or three hours and if i can get they say uh the level two ac chargers this is the the rivian's delivers up to 25 miles of range for every hour so if i'm out there mountain biking for two to three hours well now what i've got 50 to 75 miles more range while i was off having fun so i mean i i can see that making sense what struck me though about about this announcement uh is that rivian actually hasn't delivered any of their products to to to customers and you know you look at rivia and all the other ev startups and and stuff and you you can't not think of a vacterra or or or lucid or leo motors or fisk or a faraday future and so i you know they they listen you got it you're going to give riven credit they've raised a lot of money to get this um this company off the ground and i i think you know certainly we'll we'll see what what what time we'll tell whether or not they produce these goods and i and i know that we're going to be testing them as soon as we can but i just thought it was it was almost like putting the the cart in front of the horse well i mean you're so right i mean there's so many of these i mean there's so much news out there and there's so many of these you know it's going to do these amazing things and whether or not it's going to be real or not i will say that rivien has been different because they were doing a whole lot of work and being really quiet for a very long time i mean they went and they bought a plant and they did a lot of um they were doing prototypes and unlike you know some of the faradays and and which were saying oh is this great things going to come out you know in seven years uh or whatever it was um you know they were quiet until they actually had you know the prototypes ready so so we'll we'll see i i think it's gonna be a real absolutely it's gonna be a real car company but um you know we're gonna have to see we're gonna have to see you know even even in this charging network how quickly it really goes out and and and my my little message my little plug this is not deriving but to anyone put some charging stations at ski resorts i mean to me like i mean every every time like i want to go skiing you know i you know we're in connecticut i go up to vermont i go skiing and you know well i did when it was you know less covety dimes at least but um you know it's like you not only that you want to like reserve a spot you know because can you imagine like going up you know i drive three three hours up and you gotta have a place to charge you know these are this is how people need to use the cars and of course you know evs uh you know lose more range in cold weather so it's actually even more important for uh for them to be at uh places like ski resorts okay well uh we will know more about rivie and as time goes on and as we said when when these actually come up for sale you can bet consumer reports is going to buy a couple of these and and put them through our paces so before we move on we just wanted to take a moment to let you know about the talking cars donation program if you're not aware consumer reports is a non-profit organization so the work we do is funded by memberships as well as donations if you're able to give it really does help us keeping doing the work we do including this show you can find out more information at cr.org give talking cars and trust us every little bit helps so with the business out of the way let's move on to what we're driving this week and we're going to be focusing on the 2022 mitsubishi outlander you might say oh wait mitsubishi they're still in business yes they are still in business um and uh nice sorry i'm just keeping it real right tell me about your car company quincy it's not that easy oh man the quincy car company come on hey no um so so listen uh mississippi got smart they they made they joined an alliance with with nissan and renault and it allows all three automakers to share the resources hence the new outlander really has a lot in common with the 2021 nissan rogue and it shares the rogue's 2.5 liter four-cylinder engine and a continuously variable transmission and much much of his underpinnings uh the good news is standard equipment includes forward collision warning automatic emergency braking with pedestrian detection lane departure warning and blind spot warning it has standard three row seating although it is pretty tight in that third row uh mitsubishi's calling card listen if we can be honest has always been about low prices and the new outlander starts at uh 25 795 dollars and we rented a pretty swanky sel trim line from mitsubishi it was loaded uh brought the rented car that we drove to about thirty eight thousand nine hundred and fifty dollars now in our last test of the outlander we called it really outdated and outclassed so really the question is has the company addressed many of our criticisms and i turn to mike monticello what do you think well the first thing is uh i totally agree with what you're saying about this sel this this high-end trim the interior is is really nice first of all and you can sort of feel the you know so it's it's sharing some architecture with the nissan rogue you can kind of see you know nissan has really improved their interiors and you can see this there's a lot of padded pieces throughout this car uh there's stitching just some really nice trim and if you look at like the uh you know the quilted um parts of the door panels and the way they made the seat so nicely tailored you know uh they really and just the way the the buttons feel on the center stack and everything for the you know climate controls and other functions the way the knobs feel that that's a step up for mitsubishi and i think that's got you know some nissan uh you know help from nissan there as far as the driving um i sort of felt like i i think there's some things that are better and there's some things that aren't that much better like for instance uh you know there's no more v6 there's only there's only a four cylinder and so it has uh you know only okay power but it has a pretty good continuously variable transmission so it's one of those continuously variable transmissions that does the artificial steps so instead of the cvt where it winds it out incessantly uh this one does the the stepped shifts but there isn't that you know but if you if you floor the throttle there isn't really that much power i mean it gets off the line nicely without any delay but there just isn't a whole lot of power there i thought the steering uh felt a little bit disconnected from the car and it has a lot of has a fair amount of body roll and so that part doesn't seem like a you know an improvement over the last one mm-hmm and and jake what what what were you think what were your impressions yeah i mean i i i can't really argue with mike on any of those things um you know you know it's really tough for me because i i i have to look past mitsubishi of old you know i was such a big mitsubishi fan you know back in the day you know the lancer revolution you know they were turbocharging four-wheel drive everything i mean there were so many cool enthusiast vehicles mitchuishi was the enthusiast the japanese make you know and and um obviously they are not that anymore you know um and and then you know there's there's the rogue i mean the nissan rogue it it this is basically a nissan rogue i mean there's a lot of you know interesting features like i was you know again you know this is kind of like this is like you know press vehicle of all your where they go and they give you like here take a look at the really high-end vehicle that no one really is going to buy you know this is like what a nearly 40 000 you know outlander i mean yes it has a lot of really nice materials and it's got the really neat dash and you can hit the button and it changes the gauges and it looks differently and it's kind of gimmicky and you can get that very similar stuff on the nissan rogue too but ultimately i mean look okay it's got the third row seat um i mean at one point they had that in the rogue and nobody really really got that that that differentiates it but um i agree with mike i mean like the steering just seems like disconnected you know and again i mean mitsubishi to me oh it's always been like you know it should be like something sportier and and the rogue feels better um so you know and here's the thing i mean they are pretty much very similar vehicles they're kind of twins but the thing is is that mitsubishi and nissan tuned the suspensions and the steering quite differently and right and you can tell um but you know again we haven't fully tested it this is very early impressions but i mean to me that nissan seemed to have figured it out much better i totally agree with you about the the rogue part you know that the rogue does you know seem to drive better than the outlander i do want to say that third row seat i tried to get into it uh it is really hard to get into i mean it's obviously purely just for kids and purely if you just need it in a pinch it's really hard to get back into it for an adult and even harder to get back out if you can uh and just really not not comfortable for an adult back there the other thing is you sort of mention something about the gauges jake you know you can change the view of the instrument cluster and it has this sort of interesting tachometer or speedometer i don't even know how to describe it the way it it can it sort of scrolls dials yeah they're like dials yeah it's interesting i still switched back to the regular you know you can switch back to regular tachometer speedometer but it was kind of an interesting thing but it's a little gimmicky i don't know what the benefit is there but it was i guess sort of neat that you can switch it if you want to yeah you know i i hate to to agree with you guys but but no you're right the ride was nervous that the steering felt twitchy um and i thought you know you think about this expression and no offense to the mitsubishi fans out there but an upscale mitsubishi is kind of a weird way to market this after years and years of them going after a lower priced market and you know to me it's it's a tough sell to have this size suv in a market full of them and they're they're attacking you know again 38 grand on this high-end outlander so uh we'll have to wait and see we we will be buying our test model soon i'm not sure we're going to get the top of the line uh sel with a touring package but we will be getting a more mainstream model and uh so definitely check back to consumerreports.org for uh our updates as we get our own test model and uh we rack up some miles which brings us after we've solved all of rivian's and all of mitsubishi's problems it brings us to arguably our favorite part of the podcast and that's your questions we love getting them text video morse codes smoke signals send them all talking cars at icloud.com that's talkingcars icloud.com so first up is a question from bulldeep who writes i'm looking to buy a minivan for my family and i like the honda odyssey however i think we are at a transition phase in the automotive industry and i fear that my odyssey will lose its value way faster than the hybrid-only toyota sienna do you think the market for traditional gas-powered cars will crash when there will be tons of used hybrids available in the next few years very interesting question and jake i'm throwing this one to you first i think you'll be okay um i i don't see it i mean certainly it's great that we have more options i mean it's amazing that we have you know minivans that could get well over 30 miles per gallon these days but um no i don't i don't see it and i'll tell you why because you know sometimes scarcity increases value and it doesn't even matter if it's better i mean the truth is is that you know you look at some other older vehicles i mean there's v8 vehicles that are you know worth more there's stick shift vehicles that nobody wanted when they were new and they're worth more i mean i remember you know when i was a kid my my parents had volkswagen buses that you know they bought for like 100 bucks and they were no good because they they rotted out as soon as you drove them you know down the street and now those are worth like a hundred thousand dollars so i mean it's just just because it's not as good doesn't mean that there's not going to be a market for it and i think there will be people who are like hey i want to go get a you know something that has a big v6 and you know there's certainly going to be a market for that so i think they're going to be okay from the resale value well plus also if you look at it from the perspective yes we're seeing more and more hybrids and uh evs all the time there's no question about that but the percentage of the market uh you know the sales market that those that the hybrids and evs make up is still i mean it's still very very small percentage so i don't think you know he has to worry about um the value of his honda odyssey going down anytime soon and and looking at consumer reports own survey data uh the honda has other issues to deal with beyond it not being a hybrid and that's well don't pick on his car no no no but i mean when they're talking about you know if i buy an odyssey is is am i going to be killed with the retail resale value and right now um our own relia our own reliability data shows serious reliability issues for the odyssey as well as just about average owner satisfaction so i would say that you've got more issues with your odyssey uh not it has nothing to do with not being a hybrid as other issues to going on with that so anyway um great question and uh for those of us that have had younger kids minivans are totally the way to go we love minivans nowadays my boys are just want to know what's the fastest route to the refrigerator so anyway moving on dan our next question moving on next question is dan from los angeles who's writing do we have a refrigerator on wheels no um i'm interested in purchasing a hyundai in the next few months but why are hyundai cars rated better by consumer reports and have better customer satisfaction than kia if they're owned by the same company great question mr jake what do you have for dan that is a good question um and you know it's deeper than that it's not just owned from the same company a lot of them are actually twins they're very very similar vehicles so it's a great question the truth is is that there is a bunch of things that make them different so one thing is that kia and hyundai they don't even if they're gonna have like a twin you know you look at you know two vehicles that are pretty much the same like the hyundai santa fe and the the the kia sorento they're pretty similar they don't launch at the same time so what they'll do is they'll have one that comes out first and the other one comes out later what that does actually is the one that comes out later tends to have better reliability because the one that got there first has a little more growing pains and has to work out some of those initial bugs that's one piece of it the other piece of it is they're not exactly the exact same products so like for instance you look at kia they have the kia stinger there's no hyundai equivalent there's actually a genesis equivalent um but hyundai does not have a uh this rear wheel drive uh based sports car and that is kind of a new entry for relatively new entry for kia and the brand and they've had some reliability issues with it it's it's actually a nice driving vehicle but some of the reliability about has brought that down so not exactly the same very very similar well yeah so uh first of all i really have always enjoyed driving the kia stinger um but i just want to clear up that that actually there isn't that much difference between kia and hyundai in terms of our owner satisfaction ratings you know and because that was because he had mentioned that if you look at our owner satisfaction ratings hyundai has six models that are at above average kia has five at above average uh hyundai has three models at average kia has four and they both have two models at below average so very similar and actually kia is the only one of the two that has a model that's at much above average which is the key to telluride so just wanted to clear up that they actually in terms of owner satisfaction owners typically you know feel pretty similar about the two brands you know earlier in the podcast we were we were pontificating about rhythm and whether or not they're going to be another you know automotive startup that that that that can't quite find its legs but you look at the success story of hyundai and kia over the last like 20 years and they've really come a long way um i i find it uh uh kind of amazing how much they've accomplished in the amount of time they are and and i hope that you know the the u.s buyer gets over any kind of preconceived idea they have oh it's a hyundai or it's a kia but as as mike as you mentioned in our owner satisfaction surveys uh a lot of consumer reports members are are giving thumbs up to these cars well which brings us to our final question and we've got one from andre as i've gotten older i'm turning 37 this year oh 37 years old wow me too can you imagine turn out the lights andre come on 37 as i've got i've started to realize how important seat comfort is to me my job requires me to drive 200 miles at least once a week and my 2019 honda accord sport does not have a supportive driver's seat so i've been considering an upgrade how should i go about finding a car that can keep me comfortable during long drives i imagine most dealerships won't let me test drive a car for 200 miles so what's the best way to figure out on a test drive mike you you looked up uh this information for andre uh an article at consumerreports.org on on comfortable seats and what did you find well so we have a couple things going on uh we have an article that we've done uh in the past on you know the most comfortable uh front seats in cars and suvs and among mid-sized uh cars you know the volkswagen passat rated to have you know really comfortable front seats so that is one thing to think about but we also have another story which is about car comfort overall not just uh seats but car comfort overall and and maybe that's something you know that really needs to be thought about is it don't just think about a car's seat although it's very important and it's a good point that you're probably not going to be allowed to go take a 200 mile test drive but when you sit in that car there's a bunch of other factories you want to take into account that's going to affect your comfort what you know besides the seat the adjustability of the seat as well as driving position you know uh where how are the armrests positioned and are they well padded and of course a big thing for me is center console intrusion you know we a lot of cars days have wide center console uh do they bother your right knee are they really cramping your your you know uh your right knee or is it padded there at least and how where is the the left foot rest or dead pedal as we used to call it back in the day does that provide a good perch for your left foot uh you know so those are the kinds of things as well as there's other factors as well that you're you're going to want to think about ride comfort that actually affects your seat comfort you know does how well does it smooth out bumps uh and i even think that another thing to think about is you know how did the engine and transmission work in conjunction with each other because although it may not be as big of a deal on a highway but if you're on some two-lane roads during your driving you know a transmission that doesn't shift very smoothly is gonna it's gonna affect your comfort and how you feel at the end of that drive jake we know uh someone that we work with whose main uh focus when it comes to seats is lumbar support um what what kind of advice would you give in terms of of how to maximize the the person's time with it with a test drive so i know what you're talking about so so should i do my gabe impression i'd love to hear it i'm moving on no but but but it's true i mean and he's not wrong we're right i mean it goes to what mike's talking about is adjustment so so here's the thing about seat comfort now when we do see comfort testing it's not like it's not me it's not just gabe it's not just you know mike it's we have a jury of testers and we have shorter people we have medium-sized people we have taller people and this is the thing so going and you could look at customer reports and we could tell you the most comfortable seats but the thing is it's not necessarily the most comfortable seat for you because we're all shaped differently some of us are a little broader some are a little narrower and that can absolutely make a difference for seats i i think about poor seats now i mean again i wouldn't you know recommend a porsche for year long jake depending on who you are sorry jake it's porsche porsche porsche thank you you've just thank you you've just prevented all the the hate uh the hate mail every time jake says poor she gets hate mail no it's like how can you claim to know anything about cars when you don't say porsche because clearly that determines every anyway i'm sorry i'm going to find one of those t-shirts from the 80s that said uh porsche is a two-syllable word i'm gonna i'm gonna find it and give it to you or i'm gonna have it just print it up for you but but but to steer us back in the lane uh we thank you thank you we have a porsche tycan in our test fleet right now and taikan sorry and and jake you started well there it goes comes comes right around um uh so but jake you were talking so we're about to talk about porsche city so well what i was saying was so like some of the porsche seats are very narrow i actually love them you know they hold you in place but if you're a little broader or depending on your back is it could be very uncomfortable so i guess my point is you know and again bringing it back to you know gabe's point about four-way lumbar support that's why the adjustment is so important because you know i might love the lumber support but it's too low for someone else or too high for someone else so those adjustments are critical and that is one of these things that we can go and tell you how fast the car is and we could talk about how quiet it is and there's a lot of things that we could do but when it comes to seat comfort you got to put your butt in that seat and you have to really make does this car fit me and and also make those adjustments so if you're not comfortable raising up that seat lowering the seat going back out adjusting the steering wheel you might find a much more comfortable position very often those seat adjustments you go up one trim line or have a package you might have it so so if you are driving this car and they take you oh here's the one that we drive you around in and you're like wow this seat's really uncomfortable you might find a slightly higher option package might alleviate that and that's and that's one of the good reasons why here at consumer reports we do rent cars for manufacturers we do try to get different trim lines other than we're testing so we can give our members an idea of well we test the mainstream model we weren't crazy about the seats but the high-end model which we also drove is a big step upward but uh anyway hey listen great question we love talking about car seats uh which kind of unfortunately brings us to the conclusion of this podcast and as always check the show notes for more information on the vehicles and topics that we discussed just a reminder please keep your questions coming the talking cars at icloud.com thanks so much for tuning in and we'll see you next week um and i thought the steering field felt uh field who says feel yeah about the steering wheel you do it apparently you're you're outstanding in your field yeah thanks quincethis week we give our first impressions of the 2022 mitsubishi outlander discuss rivien's adventure network of electric car chargers aimed at outdoor enthusiasts and will gas powered cars have less resale value in used car market dominated by hybrids all that and more next on talking cars hi and welcome back i'm mike quincy i'm mike monticello and i'm jake fisher so as we do in our talking cars podcast we're always looking at what's going on in automotive news and this week something really jumped out in this and it is involving the rhythian uh startup ev manufacturer rivian makes is it was about to make uh electric uh pickup trucks and suvs they really wowed us all on the automotive circuit a couple years ago when we went to car shows which we deeply miss back in the day but back in the day uh and so their announcement uh is mostly focused on their charging network and it's called the rivian adventure network which sounds like adventure time for those of you who have kids and watch cartoons and according to the company's website uh and i'm quoting them the rivian adventure network is a nationwide network of fast charging sites capable of adding up to 140 miles of range in 20 minutes the rivian adventure network is planned to grow to more than 3 500 fast chargers at over 600 sites by the end of 2023 now uh jake you you brought this to our attention because rivian is is looking at specific locations to kind of build this network in kind of an interesting way sure yeah i mean what's interesting about this is um you know okay the fast dc chargers i mean it sounds a whole lot like tesla i mean tesla did a very similar thing they put in their whole network across the country um but what's kind of interesting what rivien is talking about is not just that adventure network which is you know got a kind of neat name to it but it's also these waypoint chargers that they're also putting in so in addition to those they're putting about 10 000 they're talking about of these waypoint charges now what these are are one there's more of them because they're probably going to be cheaper because they're not fast dc charging they're slower chargers but they're looking to put them kind of in a lot of different places so they're putting it in places like parks they're talking about starting this this summer they're going to put in every state park in colorado is going to have rivien chargers maybe even trail heads i mean certain places that an outdoorsy person would use so it's just kind of an interesting i thought it was interesting was kind of a different thought about this it's we're we're going past like you know the rest stop on the highway and more of like really how you might be using your vehicle all right and mike you had some thoughts about this and what what riven is going to do uh we'll have to see you know where people really are going with their electric vehicles and how important this really is to be able because i'm thinking as a mountain biker i'm thinking you know it could be interesting that when you if i were to drive to a trailhead and plug in my ev and if i'm riding for two or three hours and if i can get they say uh the level two ac chargers this is the the rivian's delivers up to 25 miles of range for every hour so if i'm out there mountain biking for two to three hours well now what i've got 50 to 75 miles more range while i was off having fun so i mean i i can see that making sense what struck me though about about this announcement uh is that rivian actually hasn't delivered any of their products to to to customers and you know you look at rivia and all the other ev startups and and stuff and you you can't not think of a vacterra or or or lucid or leo motors or fisk or a faraday future and so i you know they they listen you got it you're going to give riven credit they've raised a lot of money to get this um this company off the ground and i i think you know certainly we'll we'll see what what what time we'll tell whether or not they produce these goods and i and i know that we're going to be testing them as soon as we can but i just thought it was it was almost like putting the the cart in front of the horse well i mean you're so right i mean there's so many of these i mean there's so much news out there and there's so many of these you know it's going to do these amazing things and whether or not it's going to be real or not i will say that rivien has been different because they were doing a whole lot of work and being really quiet for a very long time i mean they went and they bought a plant and they did a lot of um they were doing prototypes and unlike you know some of the faradays and and which were saying oh is this great things going to come out you know in seven years uh or whatever it was um you know they were quiet until they actually had you know the prototypes ready so so we'll we'll see i i think it's gonna be a real absolutely it's gonna be a real car company but um you know we're gonna have to see we're gonna have to see you know even even in this charging network how quickly it really goes out and and and my my little message my little plug this is not deriving but to anyone put some charging stations at ski resorts i mean to me like i mean every every time like i want to go skiing you know i you know we're in connecticut i go up to vermont i go skiing and you know well i did when it was you know less covety dimes at least but um you know it's like you not only that you want to like reserve a spot you know because can you imagine like going up you know i drive three three hours up and you gotta have a place to charge you know these are this is how people need to use the cars and of course you know evs uh you know lose more range in cold weather so it's actually even more important for uh for them to be at uh places like ski resorts okay well uh we will know more about rivie and as time goes on and as we said when when these actually come up for sale you can bet consumer reports is going to buy a couple of these and and put them through our paces so before we move on we just wanted to take a moment to let you know about the talking cars donation program if you're not aware consumer reports is a non-profit organization so the work we do is funded by memberships as well as donations if you're able to give it really does help us keeping doing the work we do including this show you can find out more information at cr.org give talking cars and trust us every little bit helps so with the business out of the way let's move on to what we're driving this week and we're going to be focusing on the 2022 mitsubishi outlander you might say oh wait mitsubishi they're still in business yes they are still in business um and uh nice sorry i'm just keeping it real right tell me about your car company quincy it's not that easy oh man the quincy car company come on hey no um so so listen uh mississippi got smart they they made they joined an alliance with with nissan and renault and it allows all three automakers to share the resources hence the new outlander really has a lot in common with the 2021 nissan rogue and it shares the rogue's 2.5 liter four-cylinder engine and a continuously variable transmission and much much of his underpinnings uh the good news is standard equipment includes forward collision warning automatic emergency braking with pedestrian detection lane departure warning and blind spot warning it has standard three row seating although it is pretty tight in that third row uh mitsubishi's calling card listen if we can be honest has always been about low prices and the new outlander starts at uh 25 795 dollars and we rented a pretty swanky sel trim line from mitsubishi it was loaded uh brought the rented car that we drove to about thirty eight thousand nine hundred and fifty dollars now in our last test of the outlander we called it really outdated and outclassed so really the question is has the company addressed many of our criticisms and i turn to mike monticello what do you think well the first thing is uh i totally agree with what you're saying about this sel this this high-end trim the interior is is really nice first of all and you can sort of feel the you know so it's it's sharing some architecture with the nissan rogue you can kind of see you know nissan has really improved their interiors and you can see this there's a lot of padded pieces throughout this car uh there's stitching just some really nice trim and if you look at like the uh you know the quilted um parts of the door panels and the way they made the seat so nicely tailored you know uh they really and just the way the the buttons feel on the center stack and everything for the you know climate controls and other functions the way the knobs feel that that's a step up for mitsubishi and i think that's got you know some nissan uh you know help from nissan there as far as the driving um i sort of felt like i i think there's some things that are better and there's some things that aren't that much better like for instance uh you know there's no more v6 there's only there's only a four cylinder and so it has uh you know only okay power but it has a pretty good continuously variable transmission so it's one of those continuously variable transmissions that does the artificial steps so instead of the cvt where it winds it out incessantly uh this one does the the stepped shifts but there isn't that you know but if you if you floor the throttle there isn't really that much power i mean it gets off the line nicely without any delay but there just isn't a whole lot of power there i thought the steering uh felt a little bit disconnected from the car and it has a lot of has a fair amount of body roll and so that part doesn't seem like a you know an improvement over the last one mm-hmm and and jake what what what were you think what were your impressions yeah i mean i i i can't really argue with mike on any of those things um you know you know it's really tough for me because i i i have to look past mitsubishi of old you know i was such a big mitsubishi fan you know back in the day you know the lancer revolution you know they were turbocharging four-wheel drive everything i mean there were so many cool enthusiast vehicles mitchuishi was the enthusiast the japanese make you know and and um obviously they are not that anymore you know um and and then you know there's there's the rogue i mean the nissan rogue it it this is basically a nissan rogue i mean there's a lot of you know interesting features like i was you know again you know this is kind of like this is like you know press vehicle of all your where they go and they give you like here take a look at the really high-end vehicle that no one really is going to buy you know this is like what a nearly 40 000 you know outlander i mean yes it has a lot of really nice materials and it's got the really neat dash and you can hit the button and it changes the gauges and it looks differently and it's kind of gimmicky and you can get that very similar stuff on the nissan rogue too but ultimately i mean look okay it's got the third row seat um i mean at one point they had that in the rogue and nobody really really got that that that differentiates it but um i agree with mike i mean like the steering just seems like disconnected you know and again i mean mitsubishi to me oh it's always been like you know it should be like something sportier and and the rogue feels better um so you know and here's the thing i mean they are pretty much very similar vehicles they're kind of twins but the thing is is that mitsubishi and nissan tuned the suspensions and the steering quite differently and right and you can tell um but you know again we haven't fully tested it this is very early impressions but i mean to me that nissan seemed to have figured it out much better i totally agree with you about the the rogue part you know that the rogue does you know seem to drive better than the outlander i do want to say that third row seat i tried to get into it uh it is really hard to get into i mean it's obviously purely just for kids and purely if you just need it in a pinch it's really hard to get back into it for an adult and even harder to get back out if you can uh and just really not not comfortable for an adult back there the other thing is you sort of mention something about the gauges jake you know you can change the view of the instrument cluster and it has this sort of interesting tachometer or speedometer i don't even know how to describe it the way it it can it sort of scrolls dials yeah they're like dials yeah it's interesting i still switched back to the regular you know you can switch back to regular tachometer speedometer but it was kind of an interesting thing but it's a little gimmicky i don't know what the benefit is there but it was i guess sort of neat that you can switch it if you want to yeah you know i i hate to to agree with you guys but but no you're right the ride was nervous that the steering felt twitchy um and i thought you know you think about this expression and no offense to the mitsubishi fans out there but an upscale mitsubishi is kind of a weird way to market this after years and years of them going after a lower priced market and you know to me it's it's a tough sell to have this size suv in a market full of them and they're they're attacking you know again 38 grand on this high-end outlander so uh we'll have to wait and see we we will be buying our test model soon i'm not sure we're going to get the top of the line uh sel with a touring package but we will be getting a more mainstream model and uh so definitely check back to consumerreports.org for uh our updates as we get our own test model and uh we rack up some miles which brings us after we've solved all of rivian's and all of mitsubishi's problems it brings us to arguably our favorite part of the podcast and that's your questions we love getting them text video morse codes smoke signals send them all talking cars at icloud.com that's talkingcars icloud.com so first up is a question from bulldeep who writes i'm looking to buy a minivan for my family and i like the honda odyssey however i think we are at a transition phase in the automotive industry and i fear that my odyssey will lose its value way faster than the hybrid-only toyota sienna do you think the market for traditional gas-powered cars will crash when there will be tons of used hybrids available in the next few years very interesting question and jake i'm throwing this one to you first i think you'll be okay um i i don't see it i mean certainly it's great that we have more options i mean it's amazing that we have you know minivans that could get well over 30 miles per gallon these days but um no i don't i don't see it and i'll tell you why because you know sometimes scarcity increases value and it doesn't even matter if it's better i mean the truth is is that you know you look at some other older vehicles i mean there's v8 vehicles that are you know worth more there's stick shift vehicles that nobody wanted when they were new and they're worth more i mean i remember you know when i was a kid my my parents had volkswagen buses that you know they bought for like 100 bucks and they were no good because they they rotted out as soon as you drove them you know down the street and now those are worth like a hundred thousand dollars so i mean it's just just because it's not as good doesn't mean that there's not going to be a market for it and i think there will be people who are like hey i want to go get a you know something that has a big v6 and you know there's certainly going to be a market for that so i think they're going to be okay from the resale value well plus also if you look at it from the perspective yes we're seeing more and more hybrids and uh evs all the time there's no question about that but the percentage of the market uh you know the sales market that those that the hybrids and evs make up is still i mean it's still very very small percentage so i don't think you know he has to worry about um the value of his honda odyssey going down anytime soon and and looking at consumer reports own survey data uh the honda has other issues to deal with beyond it not being a hybrid and that's well don't pick on his car no no no but i mean when they're talking about you know if i buy an odyssey is is am i going to be killed with the retail resale value and right now um our own relia our own reliability data shows serious reliability issues for the odyssey as well as just about average owner satisfaction so i would say that you've got more issues with your odyssey uh not it has nothing to do with not being a hybrid as other issues to going on with that so anyway um great question and uh for those of us that have had younger kids minivans are totally the way to go we love minivans nowadays my boys are just want to know what's the fastest route to the refrigerator so anyway moving on dan our next question moving on next question is dan from los angeles who's writing do we have a refrigerator on wheels no um i'm interested in purchasing a hyundai in the next few months but why are hyundai cars rated better by consumer reports and have better customer satisfaction than kia if they're owned by the same company great question mr jake what do you have for dan that is a good question um and you know it's deeper than that it's not just owned from the same company a lot of them are actually twins they're very very similar vehicles so it's a great question the truth is is that there is a bunch of things that make them different so one thing is that kia and hyundai they don't even if they're gonna have like a twin you know you look at you know two vehicles that are pretty much the same like the hyundai santa fe and the the the kia sorento they're pretty similar they don't launch at the same time so what they'll do is they'll have one that comes out first and the other one comes out later what that does actually is the one that comes out later tends to have better reliability because the one that got there first has a little more growing pains and has to work out some of those initial bugs that's one piece of it the other piece of it is they're not exactly the exact same products so like for instance you look at kia they have the kia stinger there's no hyundai equivalent there's actually a genesis equivalent um but hyundai does not have a uh this rear wheel drive uh based sports car and that is kind of a new entry for relatively new entry for kia and the brand and they've had some reliability issues with it it's it's actually a nice driving vehicle but some of the reliability about has brought that down so not exactly the same very very similar well yeah so uh first of all i really have always enjoyed driving the kia stinger um but i just want to clear up that that actually there isn't that much difference between kia and hyundai in terms of our owner satisfaction ratings you know and because that was because he had mentioned that if you look at our owner satisfaction ratings hyundai has six models that are at above average kia has five at above average uh hyundai has three models at average kia has four and they both have two models at below average so very similar and actually kia is the only one of the two that has a model that's at much above average which is the key to telluride so just wanted to clear up that they actually in terms of owner satisfaction owners typically you know feel pretty similar about the two brands you know earlier in the podcast we were we were pontificating about rhythm and whether or not they're going to be another you know automotive startup that that that that can't quite find its legs but you look at the success story of hyundai and kia over the last like 20 years and they've really come a long way um i i find it uh uh kind of amazing how much they've accomplished in the amount of time they are and and i hope that you know the the u.s buyer gets over any kind of preconceived idea they have oh it's a hyundai or it's a kia but as as mike as you mentioned in our owner satisfaction surveys uh a lot of consumer reports members are are giving thumbs up to these cars well which brings us to our final question and we've got one from andre as i've gotten older i'm turning 37 this year oh 37 years old wow me too can you imagine turn out the lights andre come on 37 as i've got i've started to realize how important seat comfort is to me my job requires me to drive 200 miles at least once a week and my 2019 honda accord sport does not have a supportive driver's seat so i've been considering an upgrade how should i go about finding a car that can keep me comfortable during long drives i imagine most dealerships won't let me test drive a car for 200 miles so what's the best way to figure out on a test drive mike you you looked up uh this information for andre uh an article at consumerreports.org on on comfortable seats and what did you find well so we have a couple things going on uh we have an article that we've done uh in the past on you know the most comfortable uh front seats in cars and suvs and among mid-sized uh cars you know the volkswagen passat rated to have you know really comfortable front seats so that is one thing to think about but we also have another story which is about car comfort overall not just uh seats but car comfort overall and and maybe that's something you know that really needs to be thought about is it don't just think about a car's seat although it's very important and it's a good point that you're probably not going to be allowed to go take a 200 mile test drive but when you sit in that car there's a bunch of other factories you want to take into account that's going to affect your comfort what you know besides the seat the adjustability of the seat as well as driving position you know uh where how are the armrests positioned and are they well padded and of course a big thing for me is center console intrusion you know we a lot of cars days have wide center console uh do they bother your right knee are they really cramping your your you know uh your right knee or is it padded there at least and how where is the the left foot rest or dead pedal as we used to call it back in the day does that provide a good perch for your left foot uh you know so those are the kinds of things as well as there's other factors as well that you're you're going to want to think about ride comfort that actually affects your seat comfort you know does how well does it smooth out bumps uh and i even think that another thing to think about is you know how did the engine and transmission work in conjunction with each other because although it may not be as big of a deal on a highway but if you're on some two-lane roads during your driving you know a transmission that doesn't shift very smoothly is gonna it's gonna affect your comfort and how you feel at the end of that drive jake we know uh someone that we work with whose main uh focus when it comes to seats is lumbar support um what what kind of advice would you give in terms of of how to maximize the the person's time with it with a test drive so i know what you're talking about so so should i do my gabe impression i'd love to hear it i'm moving on no but but but it's true i mean and he's not wrong we're right i mean it goes to what mike's talking about is adjustment so so here's the thing about seat comfort now when we do see comfort testing it's not like it's not me it's not just gabe it's not just you know mike it's we have a jury of testers and we have shorter people we have medium-sized people we have taller people and this is the thing so going and you could look at customer reports and we could tell you the most comfortable seats but the thing is it's not necessarily the most comfortable seat for you because we're all shaped differently some of us are a little broader some are a little narrower and that can absolutely make a difference for seats i i think about poor seats now i mean again i wouldn't you know recommend a porsche for year long jake depending on who you are sorry jake it's porsche porsche porsche thank you you've just thank you you've just prevented all the the hate uh the hate mail every time jake says poor she gets hate mail no it's like how can you claim to know anything about cars when you don't say porsche because clearly that determines every anyway i'm sorry i'm going to find one of those t-shirts from the 80s that said uh porsche is a two-syllable word i'm gonna i'm gonna find it and give it to you or i'm gonna have it just print it up for you but but but to steer us back in the lane uh we thank you thank you we have a porsche tycan in our test fleet right now and taikan sorry and and jake you started well there it goes comes comes right around um uh so but jake you were talking so we're about to talk about porsche city so well what i was saying was so like some of the porsche seats are very narrow i actually love them you know they hold you in place but if you're a little broader or depending on your back is it could be very uncomfortable so i guess my point is you know and again bringing it back to you know gabe's point about four-way lumbar support that's why the adjustment is so important because you know i might love the lumber support but it's too low for someone else or too high for someone else so those adjustments are critical and that is one of these things that we can go and tell you how fast the car is and we could talk about how quiet it is and there's a lot of things that we could do but when it comes to seat comfort you got to put your butt in that seat and you have to really make does this car fit me and and also make those adjustments so if you're not comfortable raising up that seat lowering the seat going back out adjusting the steering wheel you might find a much more comfortable position very often those seat adjustments you go up one trim line or have a package you might have it so so if you are driving this car and they take you oh here's the one that we drive you around in and you're like wow this seat's really uncomfortable you might find a slightly higher option package might alleviate that and that's and that's one of the good reasons why here at consumer reports we do rent cars for manufacturers we do try to get different trim lines other than we're testing so we can give our members an idea of well we test the mainstream model we weren't crazy about the seats but the high-end model which we also drove is a big step upward but uh anyway hey listen great question we love talking about car seats uh which kind of unfortunately brings us to the conclusion of this podcast and as always check the show notes for more information on the vehicles and topics that we discussed just a reminder please keep your questions coming the talking cars at icloud.com thanks so much for tuning in and we'll see you next week um and i thought the steering field felt uh field who says feel yeah about the steering wheel you do it apparently you're you're outstanding in your field yeah thanks quince\n"